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pgil
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04-19-2006, 03:37 PM
Post subject: so I've been thinking about rivers
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#1 (permalink)
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Full House
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 1,103
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here's the situation:
You've got a good but not great hand against 1 opp, and have been playing it aggressively throughout. the river comes, and you get a bad feeling about it. it looks like it could have filled a draw, or could have paired opps kicker, whatever. he's committed to the pot and will call if you push. you are willing to call is AI if he pushes (he's too short in relation to the pot to justify laying down based on a 'feeling' about the river card, etc). my default play is to just push him in and see what happens. then i started thinking, what if I check to him. He may make a less than AI value bet since he just hit his hand, or he may check, or he may push. Either way it's not too bad for you. If he checks, you are probably still good, although you may have missed out on another bet. If he makes a value bet, you could save a little cash if he is ahead, and if you win you still make a little more. If he pushes, it's all the same, the only difference is who's doing the pushing.
My question is, will I be missing out on more value when opp checks behind and would have called with a worse hand than I am saving when opp makes a smaller value bet/checks and I lose? or is it not enough of a difference to worry about. (I play mainly $25NL).
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gabe
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Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: trying to live
Posts: 7,964
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the best play is usually to bet small on the river and fold to any raise. this assumes he won't raise without hitting his draw but will just call with all the hands you beat.
its called a blocking bet
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pgil
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Full House
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 1,103
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lets say the pot is $20, and he has $5 left. if I check and he pushed, then I am getting 5-1. If I make any sort of blocking bet, then I am getting way more than that, and folding would seem quite silly at that point (especially at the 25NL tables where people will push with so little). this is the type of situation I was referring to.
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"If you can't say f*ck, you can't say f*ck the government" - Lenny Bruce
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gabe
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Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: trying to live
Posts: 7,964
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oh
well if the draw gets there, just go allin because you arent folding and they probably wouldn't bluff you (so checking isn't that good when you know you are calling)
if you think opponent is aggressive, check when the draw doesn't get there to try and induce a bluff.
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pgil
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Full House
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 1,103
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i was thinking more a 2pair vs TP situation.
Eg. I get frisky and play A4 to a raise from the BB. Flop comes A49 rainbow. I bet out and get called by pf raiser. Turn comes a blank, and I bet out again and get called. From past experience, etc. I put opp on AK/AQ that he is trying to slowplay thinking he is ahead. River comes a K or a Q. $20 pot, $5 left in opps stack. will it make a difference in the long run if I check and call opps bet vs I push. if he bets $3 half the time and $5 the other half, will I lose more, save more, or is it not significant enough to consider.
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"If you can't say f*ck, you can't say f*ck the government" - Lenny Bruce
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piratepeaty
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Straight
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 121
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You have alot of options, it's very situational. Sometimes it is best to check and induce a bluff, sometimes it is still best to push.
To your 2 pair example. If he has you beat, he's definately pushing I doubt he bets $3 in a $20 pot very often with a better hand. I doubt he pushes/bets a worse hand here if he hasn't shown any aggression up to this point. Definately push that river. If he's calling the turn with a worse hand on a drawless board, he is calling the river. However, If he has a worse hand he may check.
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sejje
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Full House
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 883
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You're losing value when he has a worse hand.
He's pushing his better hands and checking his worse hands. Therefore you're paying his good hands and letting him off the hook when he's beat.
This is not good.
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underminedsk
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Flush
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Reraising you from the button
Posts: 250
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if you put your op on a decent hand, put him in, with a $20 pot and $5 stack sizes on the river, you ar definately losing value if you dont. I think a better situation is say, AQ, AK on a AT943 board. WIth 2p or better with such short stack sizes and such low stakes, you should put him him in every time.
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online br: $14,000, @400NL full ring, 100NL 6 max
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bigboy5540
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Flush
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: california
Posts: 253
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by sejje
You're losing value when he has a worse hand.
He's pushing his better hands and checking his worse hands. Therefore you're paying his good hands and letting him off the hook when he's beat.
This is not good.
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vnh
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im good at poker
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bigboy5540
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Flush
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: california
Posts: 253
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by sejje
You're losing value when he has a worse hand.
He's pushing his better hands and checking his worse hands. Therefore you're paying his good hands and letting him off the hook when he's beat.
This is not good.
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vnh
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im good at poker
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