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A set, three villains, and a one tone flop

  
 
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FriskyPirate
Old 02-06-2009, 02:06 AM     Post subject: A set, three villains, and a one tone flop #1 (permalink)  
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I decided to shove...
My thinking was that yes a villain could of flopped the flush but it is less likely then villains chasing with a pair and flush draw. Is this shove reasonable or should I simply bet each street looking to see if the fourth spade comes up...or if a villain is firing back into me?


$0.1/$0.25 No Limit Holdem
8 players
Converted at weaktight.com

Stacks:
UTG totto1975 ($26.20)
UTG+1 egspongi619 ($17.50)
MP1 cram24 ($12.50)
MP2 Hero ($25.00)
CO docmendy ($18.90)
BTN 36Robbie36 ($18.55)
SB Jammmeee ($18.90)
BB lawrie_bcfc ($20.50)

Pre-flop: ($0.35, 8 players) Hero is MP2
3 folds, Hero raises to $0.75, docmendy calls $0.75, 1 fold, Jammmeee calls $0.65, lawrie_bcfc calls $0.50

Flop: ($3, 4 players)
Jammmeee checks, lawrie_bcfc bets $2, $2 to Hero ($24.25)?

What happened in white
Both villains flopped the flush and one had the nut! So I opened up a big can of "luck box" and hit the boat.
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Knytestorme
Old 02-06-2009, 02:11 AM #2 (permalink)  
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I did read the white but my first thought was call and see what SB does. If they re-raise and then bb puts in a 3-bet we can assume we're behind at least one flush (or NFD with like AQ) and then what we do depends on how happy we are getting it in with 10 outs.

Basically, if we call here and it gets raised then 3-bet before getting back to us we're now playing for stacks from behind because we can't just cold-call the 3-bet so it comes down to EV calculation
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Stacks
Old 02-06-2009, 02:16 AM #3 (permalink)  
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Stacks will become famous soon enoughStacks will become famous soon enough
 Personally, preflop I would open to $1 (4xbb) from MP2. Imo it just makes more sense that when you have a tighter range to be building the pot. Well in the Early/Middle positions your range should be tighter than in LP. This is why I raise 4xbb + 1bb per limper from all positions but CO/BU. However, 3x is fine.

Shoving is way over doing it. You need to think of the villains possible ranges. What hands are you ahead and trying to get value from? What hands are you behind and trying to minimize your losses against? A shove on your part here folds out the majority of the hands that you are wanting to get value from (that is hands you are ahead of).

Now a raise is definitely, and I would raise to something like $8-$9 or so. Villains will still put it in with Pair + flush draw, Flush Draw, two pair, etc type hands. Hands that a shove is likely to fold out.

When you raise here and villain shoves, your calling. A flush isn't the only hand villain could do this with, and even if that is so you have 10 outs to either boat or quad up.
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