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Rank of all HE PF hands - from AA to 72o

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Nancy Sexton

06-10-2006, 06:25 PM Post subject: Rank of all HE PF hands - from AA to 72o

#1 (permalink)

Join Date: Nov 2005

Posts: 24

Does anybody know where I can get a FULL list of hand rankings, every pre-flop hand for texas holdem, all the way down to the worst hand?

This isn't for playing strategy, I just want to fart around with the average rank of what I got dealt for the heck of it.

I searched and searched for this before (and that was how I found this site), but never found a full list.

If you don't know the site, but know who developed the rankings, maybe that info will help me do a better Google search.

Thanks for your help,

Nancy

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lfairban

06-10-2006, 07:37 PM Post subject: Glad you ask:

#2 (permalink)

Join Date: Feb 2005

Location: Grandview Heights, Ohio

Posts: 11

I know of two, but remember, their practical value is questionable.

One is for 10 players, No Fold em:
http://pokerchance.net/nofoldemholdem001020.html

I used it to create a table on my Poker Page:
http://home.columbus.rr.com/lfairban...Fold_em_Table:

Another is for heads-up:
http://www.jazbo.com/poker/huholdem.html

You can use these to improve your strategy if you use caution. For instance, checking the difference between the two tables will show how to change your starting hand selection as the number of players decreases.

Poker is like sex, everybody thinks they are the best in the world, and nobody is as good as they think they are. - Dutch Boyd

Wyvver

06-10-2006, 07:48 PM

#3 (permalink)

Straight

Join Date: May 2006

Posts: 125

I have one with 2 to 10 players for all starting hands, but I downloaded it somewhere and I dont know if its from a book or something. I can send you the file though if you want.

- Don't Panic -

Xanadu

06-10-2006, 10:13 PM

#4 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: May 2005

Location: st. paul, MO

Posts: 966

This page has rankings for all hands against random hands, all staying in to the river for 2, 3, 4, 6, 8, and 10 handed table.

http://wizardofodds.com/holdem

Towards the bottom of the page you will see links to the charts.

jyms

06-10-2006, 11:55 PM

#5 (permalink)

Tilting Mod

Join Date: Feb 2006

Posts: 4,836

Here is an interesting chart right here on FTR
http://www.flopturnriver.com/Holdem-...Statistics.php
There is also charts for EV at 2 to 10 player tables for all hand rankings on the page

YouTube - Classified - "Oh... Canada" [Official Video]

ItDepends

06-12-2006, 06:39 AM

#6 (permalink)

Straight

Join Date: May 2006

Posts: 142

EV of hands change with how you play them. Statistically AQs is much stronger in a full ring game, but I make more money with hands like 44-33.

Nancy Sexton

06-12-2006, 01:24 PM

#7 (permalink)

Join Date: Nov 2005

Posts: 24

Thanks for the answers.

I used the list from pokerchance.net.

I just get silly sometimes when I play at PartyPoker and have all that hand history data sitting on my hard drive.

Just wanted to see how good my cards were that session, so wrote a program to rank each and then sort by ranking and print in order from good to lousy.

So exact advice wasn't too important, just reasonably good rankings.

Nancy

Lukie

06-12-2006, 05:44 PM

#8 (permalink)

4-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Jul 2005

Location: back with a vengeance

Posts: 3,307

Quote:

Originally Posted by ItDepends

EV of hands change with how you play them. Statistically AQs is much stronger in a full ring game, but I make more money with hands like 44-33.

I concur. Add to that how others play as well. Most people take 1 pair hands too far, hence higher implied odds for 33/44 type hands then they are 'theoretically' supposed to have.

Lukie

06-12-2006, 05:47 PM

#9 (permalink)

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I'm looking at this list from pokerchance.net, and I'm reminded of an old discussion on FTR. a LONG time back there was a discussion between what a better hand was in a NLHE cash game - JJ or AKs.

Now it's obviously dependant on the situation, but I argued very strongly that I'd rather have AKs.

Nowadays, in most situations, I'd rather have the JJ. Funny how times change. Just thought that would be interesting...

Lukie

06-12-2006, 05:58 PM

#10 (permalink)

4-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Jul 2005

Location: back with a vengeance

Posts: 3,307

eh, I just realized that these rankings are based on % of the time that the hands won. Not on how much money they made.

The second one is far more important then the first, and it's not reflected in these values.

jyms

06-12-2006, 06:28 PM

#11 (permalink)

Tilting Mod

Join Date: Feb 2006

Posts: 4,836

thats why I liked this chart. http://www.flopturnriver.com/Holdem-...Statistics.php

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Xanadu

06-12-2006, 10:12 PM

#12 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: May 2005

Location: st. paul, MO

Posts: 966

Some interesting things going on in that chart. The hand rankings in the bottom half are way off from real strength. This is an artefact of bad players not knowing hand values, and playing certain hands very badly. For example, 72o is towards the top of the bottom third of hands. Why? Even the worst of players know how bad it is and almost always fold it, so they don't lose much more than blinds with it. A2o is the 5th worst hand!! Why? Because bad players see the ace and play it in positions they shouldn't, and stick around in pots hoping to catch top pair. Also not surprising that most of the very worst hands are suited rather than not suited, and suited junk typically fairs much worse than the same junk offsuit hand. This is the opposite of what it should be for a good player again because of the bad players ... they play the suited junk too often and these hands are so bad that they lose more because of playing them.

jyms

06-13-2006, 12:45 AM

#13 (permalink)

Tilting Mod

Join Date: Feb 2006

Posts: 4,836

I would sa it's exactly that. This is from poker room, not pokerstars so you can bet there are a lot more beginners than experienced players there. It's all based on EV, so hands that should be folded, are being played more often, like Ax, KT, and suited crap causing losses. Everyone folds 72o so it's not as bad EV. Just looking at the bottom of the chart, most of the hands are suited. That's from people playing those hands that are usless, except maybe a cheap flush draw in position, and getting married to TPWK. That's also what pays the bills, knowing that at the low limits they will play those hands. Everyone and there sister has a starting hand chart and when they start getting beat by people with post flop skills and lose to guys holding 82s with a flush that's checked to the river and got called all-in, they all think they can play-em too.

pocket/EV/amount of Hands out of 122,000,000
84 s -0.13 368,694
82 s -0.14 368,039
42 s -0.14 369,977
93 s -0.14 368,278
73 s -0.14 368,640
K3 -0.14 1,104,211
J2 s -0.14 367,858
92 s -0.14 367,488
52 s -0.14 367,876
K2 -0.14 1,106,898
T2 s -0.14 369,195
62 s -0.14 367,206
32 -0.14 1,103,272
A2 -0.15 1,106,519
83 s -0.15 368,814
94 s -0.15 367,617
72 s -0.15 368,039
32 s -0.16 369,182

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jyms

06-13-2006, 06:01 PM

#14 (permalink)

Tilting Mod

Join Date: Feb 2006

Posts: 4,836

Cards EV /Count
AA 2.32 /550,632
KK 1.67 /551,878
QQ 1.22 /549,570
JJ 0.86 /550,948
AK s 0.77 /367,870
AQ s 0.59 /368,178
TT 0.58 /550,156
AK 0.51 /1,106,047
AJ s 0.43 /367,811
KQ s 0.39 /366,191
99 0.38 /552,062
AT s 0.33 /367,393
AQ 0.31 /1,101,249
KJ s 0.29 /365,921
88 0.25 /550,710
QJ s 0.23 /368,213
KT s 0. 21 /396,086
AJ 0.19 /1,103,946
A9 s 0.18 /368,279
QT s 0.17 /365,398
KQ 0.16 /1,103,231
77 0.16 /553,492
JT s 0.15 /367,811
A8 s 0.10 /368,982
K9 s 0.09 /367,736
AT 0.08 /1,105,376
A5 s 0.08 /367,900
A7 s 0.08 /369,231
66 0.07 /549,696
KJ 0.07 /1,105,604
A4 s 0.06 /367,553
Q9 s 0.06 /367,923
T9 s 0.05 /367,750
J9 s 0.04 /369,223
QJ 0.03 /1,102,901
A6 s 0.03 /366,998
55 0.02 / 550,840
A3 s 0.02 / 367,269
K8 s 0.01 /369,893
KT 0.01 / 1,103,705

I find this chart a little interesting in that these are the only +EV hands, without taking position, skill level and stakes. Are these aligned with anybodys poker tracker results. or is this scewed because it's based on total hands played across the board. What does a more experienced players stats look like that maybe would play some, if not most, of these hands differently under certain conditions. For example JJ>AKs, TT>AK, K8s> A2s.

YouTube - Classified - "Oh... Canada" [Official Video]

Xanadu

06-13-2006, 07:54 PM

#15 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: May 2005

Location: st. paul, MO

Posts: 966

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trainer_jyms

For example JJ>AKs, TT>AK, K8s> A2s.

Playing limit, JJ is about the same as AKs, TT definitely a little better than AK, and picking the right spots, K8s I would expect to win more than A2s. Looking at the last one, The 8 is a decent kicker, and will win with a pair of 8s a lot more often than the A2s will win with 2s, and the difference between the A and K high flush is pretty small.

Lukie

06-14-2006, 04:01 PM

#16 (permalink)

4-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Jul 2005

Location: back with a vengeance

Posts: 3,307

...The importance of these charts in a no limit game............ isn't very high.

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Rank of all HE PF hands - from AA to 72o

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