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vqc
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03-09-2005, 02:18 AM
Post subject: Pot Equity as opposed to Pot Odds
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#1 (permalink)
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Straight Flush
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 5,427
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I understand that Pot Equity is used when determining whether or not to Bet, and Pot Odds are used when determining when to call.
My question is, if i kno that I have a 48% chance of winning or splitting a pot (pot equity), and the opponents bet is only 45% of the pot, doesn't that give me reason to call his bet?
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Demiparadigm
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Party 6 max
Posts: 1,602
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Yes.
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Demiparadigm
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Party 6 max
Posts: 1,602
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This is a pot odds question.
Let's say the pot is $10 and you think you will win slightly less than one third of the time with one card to come. As long as your opponent bets any amount less than the pot, it is correct for you to call. If he bets $10, there is now $20 in the pot, and it only costs you $10 to call, so the pot is laying you 2:1 odds. You will make your hand 1 in 3 times, so a call is correct.
Pot equity is an idea Sklansky made up referring to multiple opponents, and is a good indication of whether to raise. If there are 5 players in the pot and you think you again have a 33% chance of winning, This is higher than your 20% "share" so you should raise.
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To win in poker you only need to be one step ahead of your opponents. Two steps may be detrimental.
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Fnord
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Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: I'll Do You Like A Truck
Posts: 19,333
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Then there is folding equity.
If you're in a five way pot, expect to win 20% of the time, but your opponents might all fold if you bet, then you should bet for folding equity.
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koolmoe
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03-09-2005, 04:52 AM
Post subject: Re: Pot Equity as opposed to Pot Odds
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#5 (permalink)
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Full House
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Drowning in prosperity
Posts: 1,279
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by vqchuang
I understand that Pot Equity is used when determining whether or not to Bet, and Pot Odds are used when determining when to call.
My question is, if i kno that I have a 48% chance of winning or splitting a pot (pot equity), and the opponents bet is only 45% of the pot, doesn't that give me reason to call his bet?
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If your pot equity is 48%, then you can call almost any bet. You would have to assume that your opponent will bet 13x the current pot by the river to even consider folding.
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vqc
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Straight Flush
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 5,427
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How does that last calculation work? If my pot equity is 30% how many times the pot would I have to expect my opponent to bet by the river before I would consider folding?
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koolmoe
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Full House
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Drowning in prosperity
Posts: 1,279
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by vqchuang
How does that last calculation work? If my pot equity is 30% how many times the pot would I have to expect my opponent to bet by the river before I would consider folding?
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70:30 are your effective odds, meaning that your opponent would have to bet more than 3/4 of the pot, assuming you're heads up. With three or more opponents, you can raise and make money if you are certain that everyone will call. (Pot would hold P+0.75P and you would have to call 0.75P meaning that the pot would be laying you 1.75P:0.75P which is 7:3)
Pot equity is a much more useful concept in limit, where you can often get the field to help finance a strong draw by raising when you are probably behind but have a large number of outs.
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RiverMonkey
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03-10-2005, 07:20 PM
Post subject: Re: Pot Equity as opposed to Pot Odds
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#8 (permalink)
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Flush
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 446
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by vqchuang
I understand that Pot Equity is used when determining whether or not to Bet, and Pot Odds are used when determining when to call.
My question is, if i kno that I have a 48% chance of winning or splitting a pot (pot equity), and the opponents bet is only 45% of the pot, doesn't that give me reason to call his bet?
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Actually, you can use pot equity to decide on whether to call, fold, or raise. And yes, Fnord mentioned it, don't forget about fold equity as well; infrequently a leveragable concept in lower-limit games (unless you've got some rocks/tighties at your table, then it becomes more important.
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Fnord
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03-11-2005, 12:20 AM
Post subject: Re: Pot Equity as opposed to Pot Odds
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#9 (permalink)
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Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: I'll Do You Like A Truck
Posts: 19,333
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by RiverMonkey
Actually, you can use pot equity to decide on whether to call, fold, or raise. And yes, Fnord mentioned it, don't forget about fold equity as well; infrequently a leveragable concept in lower-limit games (unless you've got some rocks/tighties at your table, then it becomes more important.
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Most low limit players will at least fold the turn if they have absolutly nothing. So you do often have fold equity, just not very much.
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jnz
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03-11-2005, 07:54 PM
Post subject: Re: Pot Equity as opposed to Pot Odds
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#10 (permalink)
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Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: On the button.
Posts: 20
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by vqchuang
... if i kno that I have a 48% chance of winning or splitting a pot (pot equity)...
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Excuse my noobie-ness, but how could you know your chance of winning a pot?
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Hands played: 854 | Amount won: $21.35 | Bonuses pending: $90 | Bonuses collected: 0
Amount Wasted During Tilt: ~$10 during rougly 10 minutes.
Net: +$21.35 playing .25/.50 limit he cash games (June 4 2005)
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Demiparadigm
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Party 6 max
Posts: 1,602
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You guess.
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To win in poker you only need to be one step ahead of your opponents. Two steps may be detrimental.
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Demiparadigm
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Party 6 max
Posts: 1,602
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There are general guidelines based on what you have and what you think your opponent has.
If you have the flush draw on the flop and you put your opponent on a pair, you are about 35% to win.
If you flop a set and put your opponent on 2 pair, you are about 85% to win.
This comes down to reading hands, determining outs and memorizing odds.
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To win in poker you only need to be one step ahead of your opponents. Two steps may be detrimental.
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jmontis
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Full House
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 1,296
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when it comes down to it, you basically have 4 things to think about that determine whether you fold call or raise
1. preflop information, did he raise, did he limp
2. style of play
3. betting patterns
4. does he play weak hands, does he bluff
there's a million things you could throw in here but using these can save you or possibly earn you quite a bit of money.
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take your ego out of the equation and judge the situation dispassionately
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jnz
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Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: On the button.
Posts: 20
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Yeah Im familiar with outs, and the chances of making your hand, but just cause you make your draw doesnt mean you will win the pot.
Was just wondering if I had missed something :> Thanks.
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Hands played: 854 | Amount won: $21.35 | Bonuses pending: $90 | Bonuses collected: 0
Amount Wasted During Tilt: ~$10 during rougly 10 minutes.
Net: +$21.35 playing .25/.50 limit he cash games (June 4 2005)
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