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Big Dazz

03-12-2006, 05:02 PM Post subject: Post flop pay advise

#1 (permalink)

Join Date: Mar 2006

Location: Portsmouth, England

Posts: 45

Hi people. Need a bit of advice on whet to do when a 3 card flush hits the board. Not much info on player4 except - he raised $1 pre flop earlier with JJ, then raised flop $3 (top pair), then raised turn with $6 (Q overcard).

See the hand history:

Full Tilt Poker Game: Table Far Hills - $0.25/$0.50 - No Limit Hold'em
Seat 1: player1 ($21.80)
Seat 2: player2 ($26.70)
Seat 3: player3 ($47.75)
Seat 4: player4 ($66.30)
Seat 5: player5 ($23.80)
Seat 6: player6 ($50)
Seat 7: player7 ($52.30)
Seat 8: player8 ($19)
Seat 9: Big Dazz ($21.85)
Big Dazz posts the small blind of $0.25
signorbmac posts the big blind of $0.50
The button is in seat #8
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to Big Dazz [Qs Ad]
player2 folds
player3 folds
player4 raises to $1
player6 folds
player7 fold
player8 folds
Big Dazz calls $0.75
player1 has 15 seconds left to act
player1 folds
*** FLOP *** [Ah Jh 6h]
Big Dazz bets $3
player4 raises to $10
Big Dazz has 15 seconds left to act
Big Dazz folds
Uncalled bet of $7 returned to player4
player4 mucks
player4 wins the pot ($8.10)
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot $8.50 | Rake $0.40
Board: [Ah Jh 6h]

OK - what wanted to do was raise all in as:
1) player4 bet was around half my stack
2) only AA AK will beat me.
3) probably has not hit the flush

but unfortunatley (dont laugh) as I dragged the mouse across I hit the fold button - oops. But thinking it through folding was possibly fortuitus considering it was:
1) a raised pot
2) and the flush board
3) i did not have a heart

Was I lucky??
Cheers
Big Dazz

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Miffed22001

03-12-2006, 06:56 PM

#2 (permalink)

Straight Flush

Join Date: Jun 2005

Location: Marry Me Cheryl!!!

Posts: 8,181

first
WELCOME!
WE NEED MORE BRITS!

second.
i hope youve read the stickies around here.

third.
Preflop call is ok, if you think it will only be heads up. personally playing a hand like AQ out of position in the small blind i probably want to reraise here rather than just call
On the flop its a nice flop for you, top pair. Opp miniraised which is basically horrible preflop play but hey. So when you bet out of position into a pot you will automatically get raised imo anyway, especially if he has top pair (yes he may also have the flush) AJX flop is a funny one as fishies like to min raise AJ as they darent or cant raise it properly so we have to count that in and that we are beat already but its not necessarily the case here.
basically you got beat by a player in position here without really knowing the strength of his hand. A lot of players (like me are gona auto raise your bet here in positon just... well because i can!)
So.
possibly reraise preflop. Not essential but something to think on
dont bet out of position on this flop. Id personally check raise here. You have a strong top pair but no heart which means this pot really wants to end quickly. If opp then 3 bets you i think its a laydown. No need to get involved in a big pot out of position.
I think the key is preflop but that is open to interpretation, just one way to look at it

Pelion

03-12-2006, 07:29 PM

#3 (permalink)

4-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Sep 2005

Posts: 3,206

Quote:

Originally Posted by Miffed22001

personally playing a hand like AQ out of position in the small blind i probably want to reraise here rather than just call

Really? I fold it unless the raiser is very loose

gabe: Ive dropped almost 100k in the past 35 days.

bigspenda73: But how much did you win?

Big Dazz

03-12-2006, 11:32 PM

#4 (permalink)

Join Date: Mar 2006

Location: Portsmouth, England

Posts: 45

Thanks for your input.
That's a hand from my first outing at NLH. Ive been play 2/4 limit for a bout 18 months and simply cannot win. My loss rate is much like sap from a tree - really really slowwwwlllyyyy . . can't beat the the calling/checking/chasing stations, the good players and rake!!!

So here I am - a newbie. You'll be hearing a lot from me in the begginners circle if ya don't mind.

Cheers

Bye the way - great site. Loads of info

Pelion

03-13-2006, 02:58 AM

#5 (permalink)

4-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Sep 2005

Posts: 3,206

Welcome to No Limit

. Keep posting.

I realised I never actually explained what I said.

In No limit you are risking your entire stack everytime you enter a pot. In Limit you can play hands like AQo to a raise but in No Limit you are often put into positions where you may face tough postflop decisions for your entire stack. Against a preflop raiser you are quite likely to be dominated with AQ (and you dont even have the flush outs with AQo). Add to that the fact that being out of position means you will be in place to lose the most if you are behind, win the least if you are ahead, and get bluffed out of the pot if you seem weak and I think this is a clear fold unless the raiser is clearly LAG. I even fold it in position but that may change once I get more comfortable at 25NL.

gabe: Ive dropped almost 100k in the past 35 days.

bigspenda73: But how much did you win?

TLR

03-13-2006, 09:06 AM

#6 (permalink)

Moderator

Join Date: Aug 2004

Posts: 5,007

TLR is an unknown quantity at this point

Quote:

OK - what wanted to do was raise all in as:
1) player4 bet was around half my stack

True, and I bet the 2nd half goes in on the turn

Quote:

2) only AA AK will beat me.

AJ and JJ both beat you and are very likely.

Quote:

3) probably has not hit the flush

True

Anyway I would not stick around and bet my entire stack to find out if I am ahead or behind. I think villian either has AJ or AK and is afraid of the 4th flush

Big Dazz

03-13-2006, 11:15 AM

#7 (permalink)

Join Date: Mar 2006

Location: Portsmouth, England

Posts: 45

[AJ and JJ both beat you and are very likely. ]

What am I thinking - Yes of couse they do!!

Ok - 2 questions (player 4 is not a LAG):

Pre-flop - should i have
1) called the small raise form SB (actually i did this to follow the beginners strategy guide you have on this site)
2)folded
3) big re-raise > $5

post flop: what was the best option with my out of position TPGK:
1) check
2)bet <$3
3)bet>$3

Looking back i should have called the raise then checked/folded the flop.
Cheers

[/quote]

TLR

03-13-2006, 11:20 AM

#8 (permalink)

Moderator

Join Date: Aug 2004

Posts: 5,007

The preflop call is marginal.
Once you called preflop you have to bet the flop (otherwise there is no reason to call the preflop raise), but I would fold to the reraise

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