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Maverick
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03-28-2005, 01:23 PM
Post subject: Position
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#1 (permalink)
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Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 82
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Im using my initial bankroll working on plugging my leaks and im starting to feel confident with my play.
Im interested in learning a LOT more about position, ive tightened up my starting hands a lot (i still play 0.01-0.02 NL, whilst I build my roll and plug leaks)
The poker book I read glossed over it very briefly (premium UTG and loosen up a little as the button gets closer)
Im wondering if anyone knows where I can sink my teeth into some big statistical charts or give me some good pointers for hands in various positions.
I play high suited conns, Axs (dont like Kxs), A(and face card), K(and face card) and PP's.
I'm unsure for the positions to play these hands and whilst im slowly building a roll, playing these hands out of position is having a negative effect on my bankroll.
Any advice greatly appreciated! 
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xxDFOCxx
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Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Saint-Jean-sur-Richelieu, Canada
Posts: 83
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Position is more important then the cards you hold. When you are last to talk, you have a huge advantage on the other, first, you saw how they bet and if they represented some strengh. Then, being the last to talk, you can represented almost anything by beting strong and stealing the pot. Of course, you have to mised it up and not always try to steal pot when your on the button or one off the button but it is there that you make your money. I played a tournement (2070 players), and I didn't have good cards (one AKs, one AQo and nothing else). When we were less then 200, I had 13 000chips compared to the average 6250chips. I cumulate these chips only by representing strenght in last position. Didn't had good cards !!!
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Fnord
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Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: I'll Do You Like A Truck
Posts: 19,204
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If you only played these hands you could probably beat your game:
AA-22, AK
Then start adding these hands:
AQs, AJs, ATs, KQs, KJs, KTs, QTs, JTs
Then, add small suited connectors, 1 gappers and Axs in position
Finally, mix in some button steals with hands that aren't hopeless.
That's about all I play in a deep stack (100BB+) cash NL game.
The blinds in these games are so low, by playing junk and dominated offsuit hands you effectivly become a blind, in addition to getting into a whole bunch of marginal spots with lots of money behind.
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Maverick
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Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 82
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thanks for the responses guys!
xxDFOCxx - i can see what you mean but playing late in the hand. You get control over the betting of sorts. I'll keep it in mind.
hey fnord,
thanks for the list of hands, I do find these perform well.
Understood the point about button steals.
Got the point of mixing it up with junk to become a 'blind' of sorts.
"Then, add small suited connectors, 1 gappers and Axs in position "
Thats the point of my post, im not 100% sure of position to play these hands in!
Is it basically group 1 hands first few positions, and scale it back to the button.
Know where I can see a chart showing me this information or can you tell me more precisly?
thanks for bearing with me, this site has helped my play so much!
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Fnord
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Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: I'll Do You Like A Truck
Posts: 19,204
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Pre-flop charts suck, learn to play without one. I also REALLY REALLY REALLY HATE the FTR hand groupings. 22 is a force to be reckoned with in a deep stack NL game.
By position I'm pretty much refering to the Button, CO and sometimes CO+1. You REALLY want to be drawing with position so you can get cheap cards, steal pots and get the maximum value when you hit. Also, by not playing drawing hands out of position, you have less risk of having to fold pre-flop after putting in money because a couple hands decided to settle things pre-flop.
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Maverick
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Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 82
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Ok too easy fnord!
So CO and CO+1 are last to act before the button? (what does CO stand for btw?)
Yes no one ever suspects pocket 2's and I enjoy a limp in with them.
SO basically I want to play the hands you suggested from late position (except AA an KK I suppose) so I can get cheaper draws and bet for value and so forth.
Nice I'll work on getting my flop % even lower now. Was around 35%ish now its getting around 28% but if I stop playing the first few positions it should be just about right.
Thanks again, your a great help!
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Fnord
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Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: I'll Do You Like A Truck
Posts: 19,204
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CO = Cut-Off, the player acting before the button.
I play AA-22, AK from any position in a NL game if the money is deep enough to play set (just about any cash game.)
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wobbler
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Straight
Join Date: Sep 2004
Posts: 134
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Fnord
If you only played these hands you could probably beat your game:
AA-22, AK
Then start adding these hands:
AQs, AJs, ATs, KQs, KJs, KTs, QTs, JTs
Then, add small suited connectors, 1 gappers and Axs in position
Finally, mix in some button steals with hands that aren't hopeless.
That's about all I play in a deep stack (100BB+) cash NL game.
The blinds in these games are so low, by playing junk and dominated offsuit hands you effectivly become a blind, in addition to getting into a whole bunch of marginal spots with lots of money behind.
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Don't you ever limp with unsuited connectors in position?
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Fnord
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Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: I'll Do You Like A Truck
Posts: 19,204
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by wobbler
Don't you ever limp with unsuited connectors in position?
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If my opponents truely suck, maybe. Against loose calling opponents I'm looking to make nut-like hands cheap and show them to them (and make them pay the max to see it.) Unsuited connectors just aren't that strong. Against tighter weak opponents I'll play effetively blank cards in position Rippy style, knowing that it'll be profitable between steals, making weird strong hands and table image (forcing them to play against my big hands once I've established myself as an aggro player that runs weird hands.)
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strix
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Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: WA, USA
Posts: 18
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I'm copying this down and afixing it to my wall behind my computer screen!
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Hail Eris! All Hail Discordia!
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sykl1
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Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: AZ
Posts: 20
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Ive been searching around for the same question maverick asked and i havent found a good explanation of position. is there anyone out there that can explain or maybe give an example. i know i have an idea on how to play position but its only on the obvious plays. thanks.
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sykl1
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Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: AZ
Posts: 20
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found it on the home page...
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