|
metaxy6
|
12-21-2005, 02:23 AM
Post subject: Passive Game Strategy
|
#1 (permalink)
|
|
Flush
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 328
|
|
I've been in some extremely passive pre-flop games lately, where hands like AKs, JJ, QQ are limping in from all positions. Sure, some of it is deception and set-ups, but mostly these are just passive players. So, of course there are various donkeys and even some smarter players seeing lots of cheap flops too, with hands like K3 s, any connectors, etc., from about any position.
So, how do you react to these conditions? Do you get in there with your K6s and TJo and Q9s mp because you don't expect much aggression behind you and you might hit a big flop and get paid? Do you continue to raise hands like TT early in order to define holdings and thin the field, or just limp those like everyone else and play accordingly?
Do you turn into the aggressor and take down lots of small pots, give way when you meet stiff resistance, and get paid on your occasional monsters?
Seriously, what would you do if everybody else in your game basically acted as if their "raise" function didn't work before the flop?
In theory, it should be a great game for a player with superior post-flop skills, right? (not saying that I am)
Wouldn't you want to see about every flop?
Anyways, I'd really appreciate any insights. Thanks.
|
|
|
Play for FREE and practice your game at...
Join the FTR Poker Forum to disable these banners and start posting!
|
|
Miffed22001
|
|
Straight Flush
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Marry Me Cheryl!!!
Posts: 8,181
|
|
if they let u see cheap flops, see more and play appropriate hands. Im playing every Axs and Kxs if i can.
|
|
|
|
Irisheyes
|
|
4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: over there
Posts: 3,708
|
|
The only change I'd make is to start playing suited connectors in a few more positions then Button and SB. Especially because passive players will let you draw cheap. Do lots of limping for sets. If they're weak/tight/passive then steal a load of small pots from the button.
|
|
|
|
Pelion
|
|
4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 3,206
|
|
I love these games. I still raise QQ+, AQ+ but i limp in with WAY more hands. Any connectors above 56, Kxs maybe Qxs in late position. The beauty of these games is that people are happy to limp in with A A and minbet the flop but they will still call you all the way down when that 3rd heart comes on the turn. One thing you have to be careful of is because everyone is seeing the flop then it is much more likely you need the nuts to win. If you have a 6 high flush and one of the passives starts betting get out of there.
This game just becomes limp with anything with nut potential and bet when you hit. With so many hands seeing the flop there is ALWAYS a second best hand to pay you off.
|
|
gabe: Ive dropped almost 100k in the past 35 days.
bigspenda73: But how much did you win?
|
|
Fnord
|
|
Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: I'll Do You Like A Truck
Posts: 19,333
|
|
How are they playing post-flop?
In generally though, they're making it really easy for you to limp a lot of hands and see lots of flops, so you should be taking advantage of that. However, that's only 1/4rth of the battle. You need to figure out what means what post-flop and make the most of seeing all of those flops.
|
|
|
|
r8ed
|
|
4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 1,524
|
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Fnord
In generally though, they're making it really easy for you to limp a lot of hands and see lots of flops, so you should be taking advantage of that. However, that's only 1/4rth of the battle. You need to figure out what means what post-flop and make the most of seeing all of those flops.
|
I think that's why the whole site is like that. First, some people did it. Then the tighter players realized they could limp more, so they did so as well. Now everyone does. We may be at the same site (or network) because the one I'm on is the same deal. You really do need to have the nuts if the pot goes up post flop. 56s hitting a flush is not gonna do it.
I actually play semi-tight there and multitable. I'm starting with superior hands that have me drawing to the nuts almost every time. It's easy money for the most part.
|
|
|
|
Fnord
|
|
Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: I'll Do You Like A Truck
Posts: 19,333
|
|
Great, now start raising to build pots *cackle*.
|
|
|
|
Pelion
|
|
4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 3,206
|
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Fnord
Great, now start raising to build pots *cackle*.
|
Whats the point if you are being paid off when you hit anyway?
Isnt that just throwing chips away everytime you dont flop the nuts/ nut draw and have to fold. Also you are less likely to have people making a second best hand if you raise. I can understand building a pot if people wont play for stacks in unraised pots. But when they will anyway it seems like a waste of chips.
|
|
gabe: Ive dropped almost 100k in the past 35 days.
bigspenda73: But how much did you win?
|
|
metaxy6
|
|
Flush
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 328
|
|
Ya, like P says, there's definitely some post-flop fireworks.
So, obviously reads are more important than ever, but critical information that would otherwise have been supplied pre-flop is missing.
It's almost like a football drill where neither the offense nor the defense can see what's going on prior to the snap, and everybody just has to adjust quickly to what he sees from the point of the snap. At that point, everything is in motion, and anyone that doesn't get a handle on what's going on is likely to get burned.
Sad to say, I've been on the wrong end of TPTK when Aces limped UTG.
I mean, how in the hell could I read that? I needed to probe raise the flop or the turn with position, but just hadn't adapted and wasn't using the full arsenal of post-flop play. I'm looking for other ways to expand post-flop play to adjust.
Pre-flop - do you adjust by going with the flow? Sure, still pfr QQ +, but if you would normally raise 99, are you going to do it in these conditions? Sure, set hunt. Sure, see more flops in lp w/ suiteds and connectors, but how about early? How about T3 s? UTG? I mean, why not - if the chances are good that nobody is going to raise behind you?
Hypothetical: If you were in a game where everyone's (except yours) raise function was disabled pre-flop, how much would you open up your game? If you could be sure to see every flop for the minimum, would you? Would you steal a lot more because nobody can re-raise you? Or would you limp more to see flops and win big pots when you hit? Would you still avoid the biggest trouble hands like K-small and A-small?
|
|
|
|
Fnord
|
|
Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: I'll Do You Like A Truck
Posts: 19,333
|
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by metaxy6
Sad to say, I've been on the wrong end of TPTK when Aces limped UTG.
|
I'm usually losing 20-50x the bb and feeling ok about it here.
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by metaxy6
How about T3 s?
|
T3s won't make enough hands that can get maximum value post-flop with deep money.
|
|
|
|
metaxy6
|
|
Flush
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 328
|
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Fnord
I'm usually losing 20-50x the bb and feeling ok about it here.
|
If you knew the texture was such that somebody might easily limp AA utg, would you min raise the flop or turn to see where you were at?
Would you ld to a re-raise, or would that just feel wrong in case he was smaller pp making a move?
|
|
|
|
Fnord
|
|
Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: I'll Do You Like A Truck
Posts: 19,333
|
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by metaxy6
If you knew the texture was such that somebody might easily limp AA utg, would you min raise the flop or turn to see where you were at?
Would you ld to a re-raise, or would that just feel wrong in case he was smaller pp making a move?
|
Post hands.
I play in position a lot and like to raise the turn a little more and the flop a little less than most TAggy players.
|
|
|
|
Pelion
|
|
4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 3,206
|
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by metaxy6
normally raise 99
|
If raising will narrow the field to 1 or 2 players who will then be likely to believe me when i cbet when an A hits then i will probably still raise. If everyone is going to come in behind anyway there is no point. you have very little chance of winning if if you have alot of callers and even if overcards come and dont hit the other players you are still out of position betting into calling stations with a hand when you dont have a clue where you stand. Set hunting is less stressful.
|
|
gabe: Ive dropped almost 100k in the past 35 days.
bigspenda73: But how much did you win?
|
English
Deutsch
Español
Français
Italiano
Nederlands
Pусский
Svenska
05-26-2012, 03:08 PM Australia Legalized Online Poker coming up in next 6 to 12 Months
Linear Mode
