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gregor
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02-14-2005, 07:46 PM
Post subject: Overbet flop
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#1 (permalink)
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Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 95
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Situation: Holding QQ, flop is undercards rainbow.....4 callers, pot is 7.50 roughly.....few checks than a 13 raise....IME, these overraises are fish that have TPTK or middle pair and overextend themselves....In this case i was in early position and smooth called hoping for a reraise opportunity
i called the bet.....ended up losing....but curious as to how people read these overbet flops on the lower limit tables (1-2NL) where you see alot of incorrect play....
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dalecooper
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Sep 2004
Posts: 3,107
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I try not to get involved in them. They are split more or less evenly between outrageous bluffs and guys deliberately overbetting really good hands and hoping for just one caller who thinks they're bluffing. It's a dangerous game calling or raising those overbets (I'm talking about the ones that are twice the size of the pot or more). Can lead to some wild swings if you just call them on general principle with any decent hand. I'd prefer to have a specific read on the other player first.
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Demiparadigm
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Party 6 max
Posts: 1,602
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I generally overbet the pot only with strong hands t omake poeple feel like they're being pushed around. Sometimes you get people who want to push back, and they are surprised when you flip over a monster hand. I do it to send a message, to keep up a strong table image.
I also NEVER underbet the pot with a big hand. Either I buy it on the flop or someone calls with bad odds. You win in poker when others make mistakes. Giving the table odds to draw out on you is a mortal sin.
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gregor
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Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 95
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Demiparadigm
I generally overbet the pot only with strong hands t omake poeple feel like they're being pushed around. Sometimes you get people who want to push back, and they are surprised when you flip over a monster hand. I do it to send a message, to keep up a strong table image.
I also NEVER underbet the pot with a big hand. Either I buy it on the flop or someone calls with bad odds. You win in poker when others make mistakes. Giving the table odds to draw out on you is a mortal sin.
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If i get a SB/BB special, and hit 2 pair or trips on the board, and am in early position, i'll slowplay it a card to build the pot...
i agree on the two comments above on overbets, i should have stayed out, but i had been pretty good in the past of smelling out those bets when they don't have it....must have got a little cocky w/QQ in my hand....have to watch that...
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EasyT
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Full House
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Yo Mamma
Posts: 834
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Sometimes I'll get 3 or 4 callers on a 3x bet. If I hit a hand and the pot is affordable, I'll bet 1.5x the pot. My reasoning is that it takes a larger bet to push opponents off of the larger pot. The other reason is that if you bet just the pot and one person calls, then a third person suddenly has the odds to chase his flush/str. Is this wrong?
By underbetting, you mean like 1/2 the pot, right? What if the gods bless you with a full house on the flop. Then don't you WANT to give the other guy the right odds to make his flush or straight? Do you still bet the pot to win right there? Is there any hand less than a boat you can slow play or give pot odds on?
This happened to me the other night: AKo. Flopped KAK. I checked it and smooth called until the river. Won big. 
The reverse has happened. K4o (bblind). Flopped K44. I checked it and smooth called. This time the river was K, and we split the pot. 
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RD Olivaw
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Straight
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Dallas,TX
Posts: 228
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What did he beat you with?
The decision should depend a lot on his table image. I don't like a smooth call there though. I think you need to either raise of fold. From the sounds of it, he probably flopped 2 pair. But without a raise you have no way of knowing what kind of hand he has. Could have been a buy, or he could have a monster.
With a call, I'd be looking for him to check the turn, to which I would take as - "oh siht, the buy didn't work lets see what he does" - and bet out. Or if he comes out strong again, you will have to consider laying it down.
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<Ripptyde> I either steal.....have the nuts...or fold
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EasyT
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Full House
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Yo Mamma
Posts: 834
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RD:
If you re-raise here, how much?
You have the overpair.
Preflop pot was $7.50.
He bet $13.00 as either a steal or because he has a very strong hand.
Do you raise to $20? Just to dip your toe in the water and see if you're beat?
If he re-raises to $30, easy fold?
If he calls $20 and then checks the turn, bet $20, $30 or all in up to $X?
I'm assuming this is a $50 max table.
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