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Newbie says hi and asks a few questions.

  
 
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epoch
Old 11-08-2007, 12:58 AM     Post subject: Newbie says hi and asks a few questions. #1 (permalink)  
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Hello all hooray for first posts.

At the moment I don't really have any real money to invest in poker but Ive been playing 10 person 5/10 play money tables at Partypoker to try to sharpen my game. Ive also bought the Holdem Poker for advanced players book as recommended by the site. I want to eventually play in the b&m casinos at home (I live in downtown Reno).

Ive begun to memorize the hand groups and what to play when in the early, middle, and late position as written in my book. What I want to do now is keep track of my hands and go over them later to find my mistakes. I downloaded the trial of pokertracker but I cant find my Partypoker hand history files (maybe hand histories are not kept for play money games?)

Could anyone please help me with this problem? Or if it looks like Im doing things wrong already provide a tip or two to get me headed in the right direction?
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grnydrowave2
Old 11-08-2007, 01:18 AM #2 (permalink)  
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I don't think it works with play money. Just make a small deposit somewhere if you can, after all there isn't much to learn at play money tables.
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donkbee
Old 11-08-2007, 04:29 AM #3 (permalink)  
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 definitely try to deposit some $, much better for the learning if you play microstakes and ask questions here.

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Thunder
Old 11-08-2007, 08:31 AM #4 (permalink)  
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I agree. Play money is of no use whatsoever. Lemme explain.

I was (and still am) like you, wanting to learn and get better and so I watched the shows, read the books etc and then I walked into a play money room. And that's when it all went out of the window.

Some rooms, I was told upon entering, were "all in or fold". Not good for learning how to play.

Some rooms have guys going all in with anything, making them impossible to read, and who upon questioning would reply "it's only play money". Again, no use to the serious student of the game.

And when you could find a room where people tried to play somewhat normally, they'd start to chuck their chips in each hand - in a hissy fit - because you've been cleaning them out.

And as for 'somewhat normally' because the vast majority haven't done half the research you have done, they have no idea about position or starting hands and thus A10 hearts UTG looks ever so pretty and so they over value it. Just as they'll often shove all in with just a draw. So even if you win against these guys, are you really developing or learning anything?

In under a year at Poker Room, I amassed over 270,000 playing mainly heads up at 25/50. And I thought I was good. In my first 2 months, with a starting stack of 1000 and blinds of 5/10 I was over 12,000 and I really thought it meant something. I'd double up within minutes of sitting down and would think how awesome it would be to say to my girlfriend: "wait here, I'll be back in 2 minutes with £2000."

And the thing is, even though I judged success by my growing balance, it got to the point where it all became meaningless. I had 270,000 and taking 1000 at a time off people lost it's novelty. I moved up to higher stakes but it was still, to me, meaningless. I just had so much and yet ultimately, all I had was 270,000 of nothing. Even stakes of 500/1000 were still just numbers only. Nothing of substance. Nothing of value and so to feed my poker bug, I had to step up to the next level of excitement: Real Money.

And that is where I am now.

As a note of interest, whilst building my BR at the play level, I occasionally dropped £30 into a cash account, went to the tables, and got a kicking. I won my first few hands but that pattern didn't last very long.

My first serious cash venture was another £30 deposit but this time playing $5 SNGs (no BR management in play). And even though you still come across fishy play, you will start a bigger and better learning curve than you ever can with play money.

Play money - as it's name suggets - attracts the causal player and is zero risk. There is no harm, going all in with just 3 to the flush and it's hard to bluff a guy off pocket 8s when the board is showing KQA. So what can you learn from a guy who won't be bluffed and who throws his money into every pot?

Children play. Children like toys. Play money is just for those who want to toy and from what you've written, this isn't what you're looking for.

Sure, my learnings helped me to accelerate my chip balance on the play tables and yes, I had an edge over my opponents, but it only goes so far. Not very far, in fact. I knew only to chase the draw if I had the correct odds, most didn't. Therefore I won more than I lost. But in the real money world, above donkstakes, your opponents will know this and won't be so reckless. Now where is your edge?

Believe me when I say, even just a $10 investment a month and playing semi serious (ie: no BR management) will teach you far, far more. Of course, to be serious, BR management is imperative but that will require a more substantial deposit. I turned over 600% profit each time but lost it due to certain factors. BR management being one of them.

As an aside, as everyone can make a small deposit, I get the feeling that maybe you're too young to have a real money account???
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okiman
Old 11-16-2007, 11:08 PM #5 (permalink)  
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Fellow newbie here. I've got to agree with the limit you can learn from play tables. I went to play tables to learn how to play nlhe cash game and started learning bad habits from the endless string of limpers. The only plays people knew were all-in or limp. Playing no fold'em hold'em can hurt a person's game more than help it. Surprisingly, even at the micro stakes, people are far tighter.
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taipan168
Old 11-16-2007, 11:18 PM #6 (permalink)  
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I agree. Money, even a small amount thereof, is an essential element of poker. Poker without money is some other game.
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euphoricism
Old 11-17-2007, 12:24 AM #7 (permalink)  
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You don't need a lot of money to get started.

When I started playing it was at $0.05/$0.10 limit hold'em. To be properly bankrolled I needed about $30. And from there I have never redeposited, and I've cashed out many thousands.

Find $30, and turn it into your retirement fund.
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Robb
Old 11-18-2007, 09:24 PM #8 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by taipan168
I agree. Money, even a small amount thereof, is an essential element of poker. Poker without money is some other game.
Money doesn't just make the fish we play against play in a more reasonable way, it makes us play better. For example, I can hardly stand to play NL2, 'cuz bets of a nickel or dime just don't mean anything to me. I play pretty well at NL10, but my best game is at NL25, where nearly every bet matters. I'm not scared money, but I'm focused.

Odd as it seems, it is somewhat more important to play at stakes that matter to you than it is to find somewhere where the fish don't play crazy.
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