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Middle pair + nut flush draw, 3way limped pot, heavy action

  
 
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DoanDiggy
Old 01-05-2009, 10:54 AM     Post subject: Middle pair + nut flush draw, 3way limped pot, heavy action #1 (permalink)  
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Standard?

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.10 BB (8 handed) - Poker-Stars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com

MP2 ($11.70)
CO ($2.10)
Button ($7.55)
Hero (SB) ($18.35)
BB ($3)
UTG ($5.65)
UTG+1 ($2)
MP1 ($2)

Preflop: Hero is SB with K, 7
2 folds, MP1 calls $0.10, 2 folds, Button calls $0.10, Hero calls $0.05, BB checks

Flop: ($0.40) A, K, J (4 players)
Hero bets $0.30, 1 fold, MP1 raises to $0.60, Button calls $0.60, Hero raises to $2, MP1 calls $1.30 (All-In), Button raises to $3.90, Hero raises to $18.25 (All-In)
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kevster
Old 01-05-2009, 11:28 AM #2 (permalink)  
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 I don't like this line. Firstly, I most likely check the flop.

Once you've been raised (albeit a min), it's pretty clear you're behind to an Ace so why not just call?
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DoanDiggy
Old 01-05-2009, 11:41 AM #3 (permalink)  
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DoanDiggy
I thought that 3-way, I likely had better than 33% equity, so my best play would be to get all my chips in. Even against a big A like AQ I'm a coinflip. Against two hands, let's say AcQc and Th9h (taking away 3 of our outs), I'm 42%. Even against two huge hands (AJ and QT), I'm still better than 35%.

Unfortunately for me, I ran into two of the worst hands that I could possibly run into: KJ and QhTh. And I was still 29% to win it anyways.

And you check here in a limped pot? Don't we want to start building a big pot since we have so much equity against a couple limping ranges?

Edit: Results blanked out. Sorry.
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sil693
Old 01-05-2009, 01:13 PM #4 (permalink)  
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fwiw, posting the results in the 2nd reply to the OP is just as bad as posting the results in the first place.
 
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a500lbgorilla
Old 01-05-2009, 03:43 PM #5 (permalink)  
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lol button is horrible. I'm torn. I don't mind the play. Do we have direct odds to call and fold the turn if we miss? My thinking is that since we have the nut flush draw, button made a mistake with his click-it-back so how can we take advantage of that mistake?

Smithers, use the amnesia ray.
You mean the revolver, sir?
Precisely.
 
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spoonitnow
Old 01-05-2009, 04:03 PM #6 (permalink)  
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 OP should read and study the following posts to increase the effectiveness of his future posts:

http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...ds-t76748.html

http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...es-t80178.html

As for the hand, I think it's likely best to just the minraise on the flop, though getting it in probably isn't terrible.

Board: Ah Kc Jh
Dead:

equity win tie pots won pots tied
Hand 0: 34.965% 34.62% 00.35% 9938 100.50 { Kh7h }
Hand 1: 65.035% 64.68% 00.35% 18571 100.50 { KK+, JJ, AKs, QTs, AKo, QTo }
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ripptyde
I only have 2 simple rules when I am coaching a new student.

Rule # 1: don't ask questions

Rule # 2: don't ask questions

I have no interest in discussing strategy with a protege'. Your job is to remain quiet and listen. I have a very systematic approach that I will share with the right candidate and I promise that I will turn you into a force of nature and show you elements of the game of poker that you never knew existed.
 
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DoanDiggy
Old 01-05-2009, 06:46 PM #7 (permalink)  
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DoanDiggy
Quote:
Originally Posted by spoonitnow
OP should read and study the following posts to increase the effectiveness of his future posts
I have read those. I'm sorry I didn't include any information on reads, but I didn't really have any. I didn't have any notes about them limping monsters (which I definitely take) or anything along those lines.

As for the "why you suck" post, I definitely need to get better at adjusting ranges postflop. The thing I have trouble with is that it seems like one opponent's minraise is a bluff with total air while another's is the nuts. In this spot in particular, I could have flat called, but it didn't look like button (and likely not MP1, unless the raise was a bluff to begin with) was going anywhere, and I really felt that I almost always have better than 33% equity in the hand.

I was fully expecting my raise to put MP1 all-in and then for button to call. When button raised, I had a minor "WTF?" moment, but I'm not folding now with the size of the pot. I can't call and then fold a bad turn, so I better get my chips in now while I still have 2 streets to hit a heart.

In retrospect, I have huge odds to just call the minraise and that's the safer route, but I feel like if MP1 showed up with a worse flush draw and button showed up with like Ax or QJ, I would feel differently.

I think I see your point, 'rilla, about calling Button's retarded raise (I think I do have direct odds to see the next street). If he shoves a non-heart turn, though, I think that I once again have odds to see the next street, and now I'm getting my chips in with less equity. Maybe that's irrelevant, though, or I'm failing to account for implied odds, or something. Really strange. Is there a way to take advantage of his bad raise? If it's possible to fold a bad turn, how do you feel about a 7 on the turn? A K? How dumb do we feel when we fold and that river comes as a heart .
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