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low to mid pocket pairs - how to play?

  
 
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smcicr
Old 05-24-2005, 11:14 AM     Post subject: low to mid pocket pairs - how to play? #1 (permalink)  
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hi, i'd welcome some experienced opinions on this please. for context i'm playing micro limits over at pacific right now which complicates things but this has been a question for me in most games i've played, regardless of stake.

i'm talking about 2-2 up to and including 10-10 (jacks and higher is usually self explanatory). i tend to limp almost all the mentioned hands from any position and then follow the no set no bet theory.

i don't feel comfortable raising pre-flop with these hands, this is worsened a little in micro limits as i've noticed that people there more often:

1. limp with very good hands waiting for someone else to raise so they can go over the top of them and i don't want to get into that situation with these hands.

2. see a pre flop raise as a slur on their masculinity or a steal attempt and so feel obligated to re-raise or you get 6+ callers to a healthy pf raise - again, not ideal.

should i be raising with pp's (5-5, 6-6 upwards?) in late position to protect the hand and also try and take it there? I guess at worst the display of strength pf might let me take the pot with a healthy bet on the flop if i do get called and don't hit.

general thoughts and any specifically related to the micro limit experience would be appreciated.
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Bezique
Old 05-24-2005, 12:09 PM #2 (permalink)  
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Pesonnally from an early position I'll limp any one of those, sometimes I'll raise 10s and Js if I'm palying Laggy. Late in the betting I'd be more inclined to raise with the Js and !0s, but not always, I might even be tempted into raising 9s on rare ocasions. But I'd have to have seen no strength from the other players.

If somebody raises at you then I follow the standad rule of thumb that so long as both your and the raiser's stacks are 10 or more times bigger than the bet I'll call.

Again I'll be more lenient with the higher pockets, 9, 10, J and play slightly worse odds on the bet to stack ratio, but not every time.

The exact decison will change if I have a solid read on somebody.

I wouldn't ever choose to raise any of the low pockets, not unles I'm on the bluff, and if that is the case then I wont neccessarily be dropping out the hand just cus I don't trip. But these kind of bluffs should be few and far between. At low stakes, almost never.

It sounds very much like you are already playing them correctly already so far as I know. Certainly for the lower stakes anyway.
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smcicr
Old 05-24-2005, 12:17 PM #3 (permalink)  
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thanks for that - i just get left with the feeling that maybe i should grow a pair and raise with the higher pp's (7-7 -> 10-10) in the later positions (with limpers) on the basis that even if i do get a call i'm 'in control' of the hand and if they have overcards i'm actually a little ahead...
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poskid_1982
Old 05-24-2005, 12:26 PM #4 (permalink)  
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Most people don't limp small PP 22-66 in early position. On the micros you are asking for trouble because of the high rate of overbets and allin's from late position preflop.

The rule I tend to stick to is 77-88 limp all positions. 99-JJ I limp in EP and raise small MP and raise healthy from CO or button with only 1-2 limpers or folded to. (more so if folded to).

I like to play the small ones from MP1-BB for a limp only...Maybe call a small raise with enough people and when their stacks are big enough to pay me off.
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Bezique
Old 05-24-2005, 12:35 PM #5 (permalink)  
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Quote:
On the micros you are asking for trouble because of the high rate of overbets and allin's from late position preflop.
I guess it depends where you're playing then, cus I find I could limp 1/2 of the hands I play and the raises on the others are so timid that it is rare to have the 10 - 1 ratio broken. In fact the raise by others tends to continue and if I do hit the flop only increases the winnings.

At least in my experinece
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Shark Bait
Old 05-24-2005, 03:26 PM #6 (permalink)  
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It's my belief that microlimits require a completely different style of play that will not be useful when you get to 10/20 cent or 25/50 cent. I've found a that playing more passive usually wins more in the microlimits.

sometimes playing more loose in good position works well because these microlimits are more like NL because the pots easily become large.
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smcicr
Old 05-25-2005, 11:16 AM #7 (permalink)  
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Shark Bait - sorry, didn't specify but i'm talking about NL ($10 so blinds are .10c and .05c)

One of the previous posters talked about the stack size of the other players so i've since done a search for stack size and PP's - there's a useful thread covering this here:

http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...e+pocket+pairs

thanks to all for their input.
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BobbySalami
Old 05-27-2005, 02:21 AM #8 (permalink)  
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I limp all PP's 9 and under if theyre are some PF raisers with big stacks. The Implied Odds are so good here that you can rip their whole stack if you hit the set and are up against an over pair or TPTK.....

Unless the PF raise is just too ridiculous to call such as 8-12xBB. But you are trying to get in cheap with these low pockets and like you said "no set, no bet"
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TLR
Old 05-29-2005, 09:53 AM #9 (permalink)  
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TLR is an unknown quantity at this point
 My view:

Low pairs (22-88) - Limp, fold if you dont hit your set, fold PF to any raise

99-JJ I will probably call a raise or raise from late position to unraied pot


 
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a500lbgorilla
Old 05-29-2005, 05:39 PM #10 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TLR
My view:

Low pairs (22-88) - Limp, fold if you dont hit your set, fold PF to any raise
I call all raises with pocket pairs except 33 and 22. And all these hands are super profitable. The reason being, if a player is raising, this usually indicates that they have a good hand. So if you make a hidden set against their top pair, some money will be flying. They'll still usually make continuation bets for when you hit a set. Even when you miss, it's sometimes apparent that they missed aswell and you win another continuation bet.

Quote:
99-JJ I will probably call a raise or raise from late position to unraied pot
Here I agree, I will raise TT and JJ from mid to late position.

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