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underminedsk
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08-20-2005, 01:41 AM
Post subject: Limp - Reraising KK and AA
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#1 (permalink)
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Flush
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Reraising you from the button
Posts: 250
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What do you think of this move? Do you think it is a waste of an AA or KK? By limp/reraise I mean you limp in KK or AA from UTG or UTG + 1, then reraise a raise behind you.
I've been trying this out more lately...advantages, disadvantages?
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a500lbgorilla
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JESUS TAKE THE KEYBOARD
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: This room is a good place to be
Posts: 8,379
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um, if you like to completely define and expose your hand preflop then it's cool.
-'rilla
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Smithers, use the amnesia ray.
You mean the revolver, sir?
Precisely.
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journey075
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Full House
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 725
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by a500lbgorilla
um, if you like to completely define and expose your hand preflop then it's cool.
-'rilla
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utg raises also pretty much give your hand away. lose-lose situation.
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boyobach
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Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: UK
Posts: 86
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I would only do this when I am pretty damn sure there is gonna be a raise after me. Like if there is a couple of maniacs at the table. But 99% of the time I raise.
What i have done a couple of times lately though, when I am feeling a little cheeky, is limp / reraise with a more moderate hand. Opps immediately put you on AA or KK.
It works well against tight passive players
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pocket Jacks eh?
CANT WIN WITH 'EM
CANT WIN AGAINST 'EM
CANT FOLD 'EM
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a500lbgorilla
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JESUS TAKE THE KEYBOARD
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: This room is a good place to be
Posts: 8,379
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by journey075
Quote:
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Originally Posted by a500lbgorilla
um, if you like to completely define and expose your hand preflop then it's cool.
-'rilla
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utg raises also pretty much give your hand away. lose-lose situation. |
You only open raise UTG with AA/KK?
Range is bigger.
-'rilla
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Smithers, use the amnesia ray.
You mean the revolver, sir?
Precisely.
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journey075
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Full House
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 725
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i only open raise utg with AQs+ for big cards and QQ+ for pairs -- at most tables anyway.
i suppose youre right though, most people arent so passive in EP.
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people often limp with PP from UTG and then reraise to REPRESENT AA/KK or because they are chumps
so no, it doesn't give away you hand THAT much
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UG
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Moderator
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 1,855
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This works at the lower limits quite well, believe it or not. Some people see it as, "OMFG this guy thinks I'm bluffing, he limped preflop so he CAN'T have anything. I'm going to push on him with my AQo and teach this fish a lesson!" There are boneheads that actually do this, that don't recognize this play.
If you're playing anyone with half of a brain you won't get much action doing this. If I see UTG or UTG+1 pull a limp/reraise I'm usually calling (depending on how much it is to call) and then hoping to hit the flop HARD. If I don't, I'm out of the hand real quick.
P.S. I have half a brain.
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Snaggle
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Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 1
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Check raising works on very tight tables where everyone is folded to a pot size bet;but gives a free card to people with pairs to hit their sets or if alot of players are limping in to hit there two pair +.I think one should always bet at least enough to drive out the blinds and total limpers;unless you have a maniac or big bluffer behind you-this includes those who aggressively bet AK and AQ as a semi bluff;than again you could always be playing against someone betting out QQ and JJ;but than you have a judgment call about whether you should just call (against strong players) or checkraise/reraise ( against looser or weaker players).
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baudib
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 3,233
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I've been doing this with AK in early position -- limp and then reraise all-in, unless the action behind me pretty much indicates QQ-AA, in which case I'd just call.
With KK in EP I've been min-raising and if there is a lot of action behind me, i.e. reraise and several callers, I'll probably go all-in when it gets back to me and take my chances against AQ or whoever really seems to like their hand.
With AA UTG I limp and just call the raise.
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Playing big pots at small stakes.
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Rondavu
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 3,053
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There are a lot of people who don't recognize the limp reraise. It's still a good play IMO if you can pull it off.
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It's not what's inside that counts. Have you seen what's inside?
Internal organs. And they're getting uglier by the minute.
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jmontis
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Full House
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 1,296
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I will fold ANY hand to this play, unless I hold KK or better
with AA UTG i prefer to just raise big, hoping that a smaller pair comes over the top of me
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take your ego out of the equation and judge the situation dispassionately
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baudib
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 3,233
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So what do you think of doing this with AK UTG? It has worked the few times that I've tried it -- like a lot of people I'm sort of at a loss as to how to play AK based on position. Most will put you on AA when you limp/reraise all-in. Mostly I've gotten folds and the times I've been called (by QQ/JJ/TT and a few others) I've spiked the K to win it.
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Playing big pots at small stakes.
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The_Bankroll
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Flush
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Athens, GA
Posts: 370
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I rarely do the limp-re-raise. I do it occasionally just to mix things up, but I usually like to raise it up.
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aislephive
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Downswinging holla!
Posts: 1,523
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I don't like to limp with AA-KK UTG because you might end up facing three or more opponents going to the flop, and you will sometimes pay off somebody who flopped two pair when they shouldn't have been in the hand in the first place. That's the perfect recipe to giving away your whole stack. If you do face a raise followed by a reraise then you've hit the jackpot. Push all your chips in and hope your hand holds up.
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Think about it this way, it exposes your hand completely, but you just pick up the pot right there. If the table is laggy then the pot might be substantial and you might even get a call preflop if you're lucky (or unlucky)
But seeing the flop with 6 other people with AA isn't so bad. You can play it for a set OR an overpair on a draw-less board. You could actually hit the set and bust someone with aces up... he can't even fill up to beat you, he's owned hardcore. And no one knew you had aces :O
But of course I raise with aces every time
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aislephive
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Downswinging holla!
Posts: 1,523
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If 6 people are in the flop with you the likelihood that somebody hits two pair is too good. And on a drawless board with an overpair you will be paying off somebody.
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Golden_Hand
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Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Posts: 10
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earlier i would sometimes limp in with AA, KK and got rolled heavy with garbage. I learned the hard way, its not the way to play them
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dsaxton
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Arlington, VA
Posts: 2,667
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I've thought about doing this with small and middle pairs in first position, but have yet to try it.
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nutsinho
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: flattin ur 4bets, makin u tilt
Posts: 3,280
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If the pot doesn't get raised preflop (and you don't get the chance to reraise), don't invest a lot of money postflop! Your plan should not be to play it strong no matter what happens behind you preflop; if you see the flop along with other 6 limpers, they're going to let you know if you're beat, at which point you fold. But believe me, the limp-reraise/push technique is the most +EV way to play AA from EP at 25NL! The fish will call with kq or better unpaired and most any pocket pair.
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