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LAGGing it up at a full table (how to?)

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stuck

05-15-2006, 09:34 PM Post subject: LAGGing it up at a full table (how to?)

#1 (permalink)

Flush

Join Date: Aug 2004

Posts: 586

So after that large downswing I posted about recently, I moved away from Bodog to Party so I could actually get hands in PT to look at them later. 1K hands later, I'm down another 4.5 buyins (50NL). Looking back at my biggeest losers, there were a few I probably could/should have gotten away from earlier, but there were also a number that were just bad luck (THREE times in 1k hands AA lost after getting it all-in preflop. The other times I picked up the blinds).

But this isn't a bad beat rant.

I was just trying to play standard TAGG set-camper style. One of the biggest problems that I had, however, was that rarely was I able to get my big hands payed off when I was the (preflop) aggressor; I tried everything: fast playing, slow playing, no one would bite (even if I would play sets exactly the same way as TPTK). The biggest gains came when I wasn't the (preflop) aggressor. I doubt this should be normal for full ring (Am I wrong?). Anyway, (over an admittedly extremely small sample size), my largest net-profit hands are JTo, 63s, 65s.

This afternoon I jumped down to $25 6-max, quad tabled, and within an hour was up 5 buy-ins despite not getting great starting cards because I just knew how to LAGG it up very well at low-stakes 6-max tables and push the small edges, tilt the table, and get paid off the times when I flopped hard.

The point of the post is: I want/need suggestions for how to LAGG it up at a full table at low stakes. The dynamic at full table seems so different for playing LAGG than at 6-max and I'm not sure how to go about compensating for it.

Thanks for any suggestions.

If I had a hammer
I'd drop in the morning
I'd drop in the evening..

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midas06

05-15-2006, 09:47 PM

#2 (permalink)

4-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Jun 2005

Location: NZ

Posts: 2,196

A full table is the same as a shorthanded table if the first positions fold to you.

stuck

05-15-2006, 10:04 PM

#3 (permalink)

Flush

Join Date: Aug 2004

Posts: 586

Quote:

Originally Posted by midas06

A full table is the same as a shorthanded table if the first positions fold to you.

Is it really that simple?

If I had a hammer
I'd drop in the morning
I'd drop in the evening..

DaNutsInYoEye

05-15-2006, 10:11 PM

#4 (permalink)

4-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Apr 2004

Location: St. Louis

Posts: 1,921

Quote:

Originally Posted by stuck

Quote:

Originally Posted by midas06

A full table is the same as a shorthanded table if the first positions fold to you.

Is it really that simple?

Pretty much. You really don't play too much differently. You fold junk in EP and play in position as you would at a 6-max table.

TheXianti: (Triptanes) why are you not a thinking person?

stuck

05-16-2006, 02:51 AM

#5 (permalink)

Flush

Join Date: Aug 2004

Posts: 586

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaNutsInYoEye

Quote:

Originally Posted by stuck

Quote:

Originally Posted by midas06

A full table is the same as a shorthanded table if the first positions fold to you.

Is it really that simple?

Pretty much. You really don't play too much differently. You fold junk in EP and play in position as you would at a 6-max table.

Ha! So it is. There are just a bunch of tightOrLoose/weak players at $50NL full ring... you just need to remind them often of what your raising/re-raising range actually is (anything!), then slow up once they catch on. If they forget: rinse, wash, repeat.

I got paid off far more often by people holding poor hands in this session. Much better.

If I had a hammer
I'd drop in the morning
I'd drop in the evening..

Grasshopper

05-16-2006, 04:38 AM

#6 (permalink)

Join Date: Feb 2006

Posts: 13

So is what you are saying is:

If the table is tight, show your hole cards after some wins that are out right bluffs, to get them to bet?

I know tonight I made a big bluff with nothing and won. I was so happy I showed my cards ... just to rub it in. Then thought, that was stupid, now I will not be able to get anyone to fold! But I hit some monsters in the next few hands, they all thought I was bluffing and I cleaned up so much everyone left the table!

Also, I have used what I think is the reverse strategy. When I am on a streak of poor hole cards, I show my wins. This seems to make people more apt to fold to my bigger bets when I have do in fact have crap cards.

Ah controling the action... it would be nice!

If the above is true, it will definately help my game!

Thanks!

Renton

05-16-2006, 05:45 AM

#7 (permalink)

Straight Flush

Join Date: Jan 2006

Location: Atlanta, GA, USA

Posts: 5,991

Most good laggs at full ring are still pretty tight (like <25% vpip/<15%) PFR.

The laggs that are looser or more aggressive than that are generally really bad, and I win massive pots off of them with top pair.

stuck

05-16-2006, 05:50 PM

#8 (permalink)

Flush

Join Date: Aug 2004

Posts: 586

Quote:

Originally Posted by Renton

Most good laggs at full ring are still pretty tight (like <25% vpip/<15%) PFR.

This makes sense. I think last night I was running something like 29/21 (or something like that). But I had good reason to: people kept folding to my PF raises. I had to constantly raise, pick up the blinds (maybe even a limper!), and show my 9/4o (sometimes two or three times in a row) in order to get people to continue to play back at me. Would this work at 200NL? Very doubtful.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Renton

The laggs that are looser or more aggressive than that are generally really bad, and I win massive pots off of them with top pair.

Naturally post flop I played much more carefully, c-betting (even still they would usually lay down) but showing these much more selectively. I fired the second barrel a few times, but only on select players who I had reads on. I don't think I ever went all the way to the river on a complete bluff.

If I had a hammer
I'd drop in the morning
I'd drop in the evening..

Rondavu

05-16-2006, 06:57 PM

#9 (permalink)

4-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Jan 2005

Posts: 3,053

The other night I had a lagg session where I was being check raised hard on the turn and being shown garbage by the people playing back at me. I had nothing to remain with. What can I say? It's what I asked for. I'm not opposed to 3-betting back with air, but it's really risky. All I could say was Touché.

It's not what's inside that counts. Have you seen what's inside?
Internal organs. And they're getting uglier by the minute.

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