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IowaSkinsFan
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06-30-2006, 08:10 PM
Post subject: KQ, AJ, and TT are big losers for me (full ring 25 NL)
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#1 (permalink)
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Straight Flush
Join Date: Oct 2004
Posts: 7,148
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According to PT those hands are big losers for me, however I only have like 6,000 hands. If these stats are true my resolve is this.
- fold KQ and AJ UTG and UTG +1 (Stats also show I lose a lot UTG with these hands.)
- play TT only for set value in EP and MP, raise in LP.
Fine?
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Miffed22001
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Straight Flush
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Marry Me Cheryl!!!
Posts: 8,181
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6max or fr?
fr are all limps for me i think, or possibly even open fold. Of course if its a tight table then id prob raise hoping to steal or c-bet the flop. Really dependant on table structure
One problem i think these hands hold isnt necessarily domination but that when you hit tp with AJ or KQ you get called down a lot and its diffciult to find the difference on later streets between opponents putting you on missed overs or actually having a hand. Perhaps we overplay them a bit?
6max all are a raise without question in any position apart from sb perhaps
They certainly shudnt be losers imo
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dwags222
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Straight
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Gaylord, MI
Posts: 151
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6-MAX raise k-q any position??
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Miffed22001
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Straight Flush
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Marry Me Cheryl!!!
Posts: 8,181
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by dwags222
6-MAX raise k-q any position??
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u limp KQo in 6max??!?!?
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jackvance
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 2,910
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by dwags222
6-MAX raise k-q any position??
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yeah..
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Sarcasm is your body's natural defense against stupidity
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Warpe
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Moderator
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Canuckistan
Posts: 3,905
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They're all winners for me over 20K hands. I think your sample size is too small.
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Miffed22001
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Straight Flush
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Marry Me Cheryl!!!
Posts: 8,181
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6max, database 200k
KQo/KQs
+0.5bbs won per time dealt
AJo/AJs
+0.35bbs won pre time dealt.
If this was KJo/KJs then yeah, that hand sucks oop but KQ/AJ?
Fr with these hands is still a great/classic strategy discussion. 6max id argue hardly so, its raising hand imo.
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The Izebox
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06-30-2006, 08:41 PM
Post subject: aj kq 1010
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#8 (permalink)
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Flush
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: bronx new york
Posts: 255
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at a six max these are all playable hands from any position (in most situation) Try raising the pot preflop to reduce the callers, these hands lose value multiway. I would fold aj and kq if there was a ep raise and a call, simply because i dont feel comfortable playing top pair 3 handed from the ep. I would probably reraise the ten and bet big on the flop (if no ace) but be prepared to lay it down if im played back at. I think your problem that you see flops with too many other players.
This is for six max, at a FR i dont know how to play cash games...In a tourny id fold from the ep and open with all three...i might raise ep with the tens tho, depends on stacks
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Me? I always tell the truth.
Even when I lie.
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dwags222
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Straight
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Gaylord, MI
Posts: 151
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I will raise k-q +1 to the button when folded to me most of the time...becoming more likely as i move toward the button, and limp w/ it the rest of the time. i would never raise k-q in the blinds unless the game was playing pretty tight or i had a tight image and or everyone was weak.
i guess if i had recently showed down a big hand w/ a big pot i might raise also.
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The Izebox
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Flush
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: bronx new york
Posts: 255
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i agree with your blind play but why would you limp with kq from utg...you see a 59k flop with 6 callers then you have no idea where you stand. I say this is an easy raise/fold situation
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Me? I always tell the truth.
Even when I lie.
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IowaSkinsFan
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Straight Flush
Join Date: Oct 2004
Posts: 7,148
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lol no, I Play full ring.[/b]
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Miffed22001
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Straight Flush
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Marry Me Cheryl!!!
Posts: 8,181
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by IowaSkinsFan
lol no full ring.
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if its full ring then we'll be here all day.
Its a classic.
On a tight table i will open UTg with KQ/AJ (esp sooted :P) whereas at a loose table ill probably open fold AJ/KQo utg but ill limp with the sooted verison in hope that the table is loose passive and ill catch a flop and a fish with a worse hand
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DaHorror
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Full House
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 616
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Miffed22001
whereas at a loose table ill probably open fold AJ/KQo utg but ill limp with the sooted verison in hope that the table is loose passive and ill catch a flop and a fish with a worse hand
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to complete the thought...
"but I'll fold to any respectable raise, given the caveat that the raiser is respectable."
Given that completion (which is implied but unstated), I fully agree with your FR AJ/KQ treatment at both loose and tight tables.
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Lukie
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07-01-2006, 05:50 AM
Post subject: Re: KQ, AJ, and TT are big losers for me.
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#14 (permalink)
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: back with a vengeance
Posts: 3,307
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i'm going to assume this means that you play exclusively 6-max.
Quote:
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Originally Posted by IowaSkinsFan
According to PT those hands are big losers for me, however I only have like 6,000 hands. If these stats are true my resolve is this.
- fold KQ and AJ UTG and UTG +1 (Stats also show I lose a lot UTG with these hands.)
- play TT only for set value in EP and MP, raise in LP.
Fine?
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This is way too weak IMO. In a 6-max game, TT should be an auto-raise in an unraised pot. No way you should only be playing it just for set value. I also open raise KQ/AJ, but sometimes if I'm UTG or something and there's a tough player on the button, I'll fold a hand like KQo and not think twice about it.
Post-flop, these hands can be tough to play out of position, but that's just the nature of the game. 
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Pelion
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07-02-2006, 12:03 PM
Post subject: Re: KQ, AJ, and TT are big losers for me.
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#15 (permalink)
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 3,206
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Lukie
i'm going to assume this means that you play exclusively 6-max. |
I read it as
meaning the exact opposite of what you said.
=)
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gabe: Ive dropped almost 100k in the past 35 days.
bigspenda73: But how much did you win?
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Renton
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Straight Flush
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Atlanta, GA, USA
Posts: 5,991
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At full ring I toss AJo in the first two positions and I raise AJs. Same with KQ/KQs. In other positions raise them like anything else. They are both very playable hands. KQ is one of my favorite hands because since your raise reps Ax you actually have three cards that can bail you out on the flop.
TT is a raise in all positions and a bet / bet / bet/ fold to any raise type of hand a lot of the time. Just be prepared to let it go in overpair v. overpair confrontations.
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a500lbgorilla
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JESUS TAKE THE KEYBOARD
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: This room is a good place to be
Posts: 8,379
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um, if you win one big pot with any of these hands, are they still losers?
I think you're jumping the gun on this one over just 6k hands.
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Smithers, use the amnesia ray.
You mean the revolver, sir?
Precisely.
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Lukie
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07-02-2006, 03:30 PM
Post subject: Re: KQ, AJ, and TT are big losers for me.
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#18 (permalink)
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: back with a vengeance
Posts: 3,307
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Pelion
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Lukie
i'm going to assume this means that you play exclusively 6-max. |
I read it as
meaning the exact opposite of what you said.
=) |
lol, no full ring
lol no, full ring
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IowaSkinsFan
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07-02-2006, 03:35 PM
Post subject: Re: KQ, AJ, and TT are big losers for me.
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#19 (permalink)
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Straight Flush
Join Date: Oct 2004
Posts: 7,148
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Lukie
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Pelion
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Lukie
i'm going to assume this means that you play exclusively 6-max.
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I read it as
meaning the exact opposite of what you said.
=) |
lol, no full ring
lol no, full ring
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I play full ring.
I'm going to assume your exclusively an asshole.
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Lukie
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07-02-2006, 04:30 PM
Post subject: Re: KQ, AJ, and TT are big losers for me.
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#20 (permalink)
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: back with a vengeance
Posts: 3,307
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by IowaSkinsFan
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Lukie
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Pelion
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Lukie
i'm going to assume this means that you play exclusively 6-max.
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I read it as
meaning the exact opposite of what you said.
=) |
lol, no full ring
lol no, full ring
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I play full ring.
I'm going to assume your exclusively an asshole. |
um, ok. I was honestly confused by the way you worded it and I was trying to make a funny spin off on it.
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IowaSkinsFan
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Straight Flush
Join Date: Oct 2004
Posts: 7,148
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Yeah it's fine. Maybe i'll edit the topic so it's clearer.
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Lukie
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: back with a vengeance
Posts: 3,307
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Alright, sounds good.
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jackvance
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07-02-2006, 05:28 PM
Post subject: Re: KQ, AJ, and TT are big losers for me.
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#23 (permalink)
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 2,910
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by IowaSkinsFan
I'm going to assume your exclusively an asshole.
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huh?
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Sarcasm is your body's natural defense against stupidity
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Lukie
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07-02-2006, 07:20 PM
Post subject: Re: KQ, AJ, and TT are big losers for me.
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#24 (permalink)
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: back with a vengeance
Posts: 3,307
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by jackvance
Quote:
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Originally Posted by IowaSkinsFan
I'm going to assume your exclusively an asshole.
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huh? |
I think my "lol, no full ring; lol no, full ring" comment was a bit over the top.
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Lukie
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: back with a vengeance
Posts: 3,307
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I usually always raise TT in all unraised pots, and I'll fold stuff like KQo/AJo from EP, and usually raise them from MP on. That's a rough guideline but approximates how I'd usually play.
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