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germansupreme
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05-04-2008, 07:07 AM
Post subject: knowing when to stop online
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#1 (permalink)
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Join Date: May 2008
Location: glendale heights, IL
Posts: 8
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so heres the thing guys, i placed in a freeroll about 8 months ago and made like 8 dollars. i then grinded it out to 2300 over 6 months on UB. i went all the way from .05/.10 to .5/1 NL. towards the end of the 6 months, i had a straight week of terrible beats and coolers that only people who play poker a lot can relate to.
again it happened to me earlier today, my friend put 50$ online for me and i built it up to 125$ playing .05/.1 NL. throughout yesterday and today, i lost 10 buyings (100$) through constant bad beats and coolers. shit like i would have trips and they would have a better kicker.
I used to playing poker for a living for about 10 months, then i went outside my bankroll and lost most of it. i was playing between 1-2 and 2-5 live and was making a damn good living on it. but online is different, i used to lose one buy in live and leave. when i play online, if i lost, im right back on in an hour or two trying to make it back.
so heres my question for u guys, when's a good time to stop the online session? 1-2 buyins? 3 bad beats? wut do u guys think?
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AlphaKennyBody
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3-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 108
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Well first off don't play 10NL with only 5 buyins...you're basically asking for trouble.
As for the question at hand, I usually stop after losing about 3 buyins or so, but it varies among everyone (different people have different...pain thresholds, I guess you could call it). Other stuff like sleepiness and just plain getting bored can make me quit also.
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Andrew
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05-04-2008, 05:55 PM
Post subject: Re: knowing when to stop online
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#3 (permalink)
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Straight
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 210
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I usually set myself a time-limit. I am going to play for x amount of hours and whatever happens in that time-frame happens. I've been down 3 1/2 buyins only to swing up and win 3 1/2 buyins by the end of my session because I refused to allow the money side of things get to me. If you find that you have problems doing this then set a buyin limit. It's really down to you and your mentality.
Quote:
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Originally Posted by germansupreme
again it happened to me earlier today, my friend put 50$ online for me and i built it up to 125$ playing .05/.1 NL. throughout yesterday and today, i lost 10 buyings (100$) through constant bad beats and coolers. shit like i would have trips and they would have a better kicker.
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Set over set is a kick in the nuts. Trips vs trips is asking for trouble. I'd sugguest you learn to spot when you might be out-kicked, or at least tone down your aggression with trips rather than a set.
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euphoricism
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Your place or my place
Posts: 3,610
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You WILL NOT survive on 5 buyins. I dont care if youre Phil Ivey, if you have 5 buyins your chances of going broke are significantly increased through no fault of your own.
Take your $50 and play 2NL. Build up slowly.
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daven
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Straight Flush
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: soaking up ethanol, moving on up
Posts: 5,805
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1) read and understand the bankroll management threads.
2) follow the suggestions in these threads
3) Profit, if you follow those rules you can't turn $2.5k into zero, cos you will drop down before that happens. Think about it.
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germansupreme
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Join Date: May 2008
Location: glendale heights, IL
Posts: 8
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guys, i fully understand bankroll management, ive helped plenty of friends with it, 20x 100x bb should be ur roll. bankroll management is not my problem, my problem is figuring out when to stop playing when im stuck. i really dont have the time to playing 2 NL as of right now, it would take me months to get up to 10 NL and i really dont see the point in that. i average about 2 1/2 bb's per hour on my entire online career so far, which isnt bad.
one of the reasons i lost so much a couple nights ago was because i was experimenting with a very agressive style of play, which isnt profitable at these low of stakes.
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d0zer
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Moderator
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 2,519
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I find setting time-limits works the best for me.
It helps me to think in terms of my average hourly rate, or ptbb/100. I've been averaging about $60/hr 9-tabling 100NL, so I figure if I play for an hour I've essentially made $60, regardless of what I actually made. It sucks being down, but you're no more likely to make it back right then while you 'feel down', than if you just wait till tomorrow's session.
In fact you're more likely to spew cash in that mindset of 'having to make it back' than you are from a fresh, neutral, objective state.
Look at your monthly graphs, look at all the downswings, and put them into perspective of the whole month's winnings. Then remember those graphs when you're down 3 buy-ins in a session.
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spoonitnow
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Straight Flush
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: IRC Chat Room
Posts: 5,406
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by germansupreme
guys, i fully understand bankroll management, ive helped plenty of friends with it, 20x 100x bb should be ur roll. bankroll management is not my problem, my problem is figuring out when to stop playing when im stuck. i really dont have the time to playing 2 NL as of right now, it would take me months to get up to 10 NL and i really dont see the point in that. i average about 2 1/2 bb's per hour on my entire online career so far, which isnt bad.
one of the reasons i lost so much a couple nights ago was because i was experimenting with a very agressive style of play, which isnt profitable at these low of stakes. |
Yeah it is pretty bad actually, especially at these limits. Move down.
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Ripptyde
I only have 2 simple rules when I am coaching a new student.
Rule # 1: don't ask questions
Rule # 2: don't ask questions
I have no interest in discussing strategy with a protege'. Your job is to remain quiet and listen. I have a very systematic approach that I will share with the right candidate and I promise that I will turn you into a force of nature and show you elements of the game of poker that you never knew existed.
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germansupreme
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Join Date: May 2008
Location: glendale heights, IL
Posts: 8
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buddy, were talking about my all time online career, which was started off as a donk when i was still in highschool playing 100$ NL with 50 bux. if u take into account all my losses from back in the day, then 2 1/2 bb per hour isnt that bad. as of recently, i win a lot more than i used to because i know alot more now.
and ty to dozer for actually answering the question that i asked and ty for the advice, ill take it into consideration
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Warpe
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Moderator
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Canuckistan
Posts: 3,905
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meeloche
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 2,131
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Warpe
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Seabass
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05-06-2008, 06:32 AM
Post subject: Re: knowing when to stop online
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#12 (permalink)
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Straight
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: trying not to die
Posts: 205
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by germansupreme
so heres the thing guys, i placed in a freeroll about 8 months ago and made like 8 dollars. i then grinded it out to 2300 over 6 months on UB. i went all the way from .05/.10 to .5/1 NL. towards the end of the 6 months, i had a straight week of terrible beats and coolers that only people who play poker a lot can relate to.
again it happened to me earlier today, my friend put 50$ online for me and i built it up to 125$ playing .05/.1 NL. throughout yesterday and today, i lost 10 buyings (100$) through constant bad beats and coolers. shit like i would have trips and they would have a better kicker.
I used to playing poker for a living for about 10 months, then i went outside my bankroll and lost most of it. i was playing between 1-2 and 2-5 live and was making a damn good living on it. but online is different, i used to lose one buy in live and leave. when i play online, if i lost, im right back on in an hour or two trying to make it back.
so heres my question for u guys, when's a good time to stop the online session? 1-2 buyins? 3 bad beats? wut do u guys think? |
I leave when I feel tired/uninspired, all the tables have gone bad or the tilt is sneaking up on me.
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BigBadBull
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3-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 103
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rationality should be the main determinant. play when you are in a rational state of mind and constantly watch yourself. As soon as you find yourself playing irrationally- that's -EV and it's up to you weather you want to keep playing under your expected value or not.
Get PokerMindset, the book talks a lot about it and can explain things loads better then I can tell you(ldo). It says that you should imagine your poker sessions not as seperate ones, but one long session with ups and downs. Once you start looking at it like that- it will be much easier to quit because there is really no difference wheather you quit up or down- if you play rationally making +EV decisions you should be pretty happy regrdless of results.
but yeah, rationality is the key
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euphoricism
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Your place or my place
Posts: 3,610
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I leave when my bankroll is too small for the stakes I'm playing.
Try that.
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BigBadBull
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3-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 103
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by euphoricism
I leave when my bankroll is too small for the stakes I'm playing.
Try that.
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I loled....then realized you might actually did that....now i feel like an ass...
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germansupreme
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Join Date: May 2008
Location: glendale heights, IL
Posts: 8
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one of the biggest rational decisions for cashing out/leaving a table with me is when i actually think the words "maybe i should cash out now". as soon as i do, i start playing with scared money. my valuable tight agressive style becomes tight passive and i start losing money almost immediately. i suggest all players either leave the game or take a break from it until ur mindset is back to normal, cause if u arent thinking correctly, ur gonna lose more than ur gonna win.
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Pythonic
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Flush
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: In S-mart Swallowing Your Soul!
Posts: 586
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Don't every lose more than 10% of your bankroll in one day.
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Never bet on a white man in the heavyweight division!
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MuddyWicket
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Flush
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: UK, Brighton
Posts: 368
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When the bottle is empty and there is none left in the fridge....
although i did have to stop halfway through a bottle the other day. Think i had a bug...
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grinderjr
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Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 12
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you should mix up the game style you are playing, if you have just lost in a tournament then you should go to heads up, when you know that your tight agressive style that you are just coming off of will be successful, also always play according to your bankroll, unless you are on a streak. Winning streak -go up, losing streak - go down. If you are on a losing streak the main thing is to get your confidence back and your game back, not the money. If you are a good player, as soon as you get your game and confidence back, you will definitely make your money back, so don't worry about making it back right after some bad beats, since most likely you will be on tilt. Also introduce the opp's chipstack size as a major factor in your playing, it will reduce bad beats. When you know you have the best hand for sure, make the pots big, when you that there is a possibility that a hand can beat you and the opp is being ultra agg. check/call more than raising.
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deacon_bluez
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Straight
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Minnesota, USA
Posts: 216
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by grinderjr
you should mix up the game style you are playing, if you have just lost in a tournament then you should go to heads up, when you know that your tight agressive style that you are just coming off of will be successful, also always play according to your bankroll, unless you are on a streak. Winning streak -go up, losing streak - go down. If you are on a losing streak the main thing is to get your confidence back and your game back, not the money. If you are a good player, as soon as you get your game and confidence back, you will definitely make your money back, so don't worry about making it back right after some bad beats, since most likely you will be on tilt. Also introduce the opp's chipstack size as a major factor in your playing, it will reduce bad beats. When you know you have the best hand for sure, make the pots big, when you that there is a possibility that a hand can beat you and the opp is being ultra agg. check/call more than raising.
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OP was all about avoiding tilt and shaking off bad beats and coolers. So after getting knocked out of a tourney, playing some heads up is a great option. No variance there.... 
Actually I agree with everything else you had to say.
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Sue me if I play too long....
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tooonyg
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nice
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BigBadBull
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3-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 103
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by tooonyg
nice
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ill have a #6 with a dr.pepper and a large apple pie
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bigteif
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3-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 116
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by grinderjr
you should mix up the game style you are playing, if you have just lost in a tournament then you should go to heads up, when you know that your tight agressive style that you are just coming off of will be successful, also always play according to your bankroll, unless you are on a streak. Winning streak -go up, losing streak - go down. If you are on a losing streak the main thing is to get your confidence back and your game back, not the money. If you are a good player, as soon as you get your game and confidence back, you will definitely make your money back, so don't worry about making it back right after some bad beats, since most likely you will be on tilt. Also introduce the opp's chipstack size as a major factor in your playing, it will reduce bad beats. When you know you have the best hand for sure, make the pots big, when you that there is a possibility that a hand can beat you and the opp is being ultra agg. check/call more than raising.
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I don't think you should be playing outside your bankroll even if your winning or losing. If you lose 10 buyins and your bankroll drops sure move down. If you've won 10 buyins and your bankroll increases sure move up. But stay in your bankroll don't go out of it.
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Fnord
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Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: I'll Do You Like A Truck
Posts: 19,333
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A lot of this depends on if you can reload out of your income or not. A lot of the bankroll guidlines are written for pros.
If you can afford to play, feel well and think you have an edge, play. When you're having trouble move down. When you're running good and feeling strong, take shots at the next level.
The bottom line is to have fun and make money. So few players accomplish that.
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bigteif
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3-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 116
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ya its probably best to play with your bankroll lets say you have only 3 buyins online but can reload. It helps you to stop once you have lost because you have more money and can usualy only reload once per day.
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