KK has not been working out for me

**Senguin** · 06-12-2009 02:06 PM

Well i can't post any hands yet, it says i have to have 10 posts first. So i'll just say the last 4 hands of KK have been horrendous. Only one of them has been up against anything -- AKs, and i lost with an A onthe flop. the other ones were against chasers, hitting rivers for two pair, one straight, and the other hit a set when he hit turn and river of one of his cards. That is a $10 swing in my small bankroll. How do you handle that when your bankroll is small. That's like at least a couple of weeks earnings.

**Luco** · 06-12-2009 02:27 PM

1/ It's an incredibly small sample size
2/ Your bankroll should be built to withstand these inevitable swings
3/ Don't start allowing this to influence the way you play KK in future, unless you're already doing it wrong.

**JKDS** · 06-12-2009 03:35 PM

what is your bankroll? what stakes are you playing?

**Senguin** · 06-12-2009 04:37 PM

On Full Tilt i have around $113 now, and was at $125 after the beats. I'm playing 5NL.

I have more money on other accounts but i like to have each one play like their own bankroll.

**JKDS** · 06-12-2009 04:45 PM

ya, kk. dont sweat it. you're bankroll is large enough to handle swings like that and you'll recover in no time so long as you arent doing silly things. as soon as you can though, you should post some of those hands in this thread because i have a feeling that they arent all coolers. some likely are, but whenever i lose a large amount of buyins (like the 8 i did recently) i can usually find a bunch of things that i shouldnt have been doing.

**Senguin** · 06-12-2009 04:47 PM

Just 3 more posts and i'll be posting some hands. One hand was all in preflop, KK vs AKs. Not much i can do about that.

**JKDS** · 06-12-2009 04:49 PM

Originally Posted by Senguin

Just 3 more posts and i'll be posting some hands. One hand was all in preflop, KK vs AKs. Not much i can do about that.

right, this would be one of the coolers although betsizing might be an issue (doubt it).

also...

http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...08-t67665.html

^^go there, and do that.

**Senguin** · 06-12-2009 05:34 PM

Ok got Mirc up and running, i'll probably log onto it tonight when i play. also this is my 10th post so i will post the other three KK hands next.

**spoonitnow** · 06-12-2009 05:37 PM

Originally Posted by Senguin

Ok got Mirc up and running, i'll probably log onto it tonight when i play. also this is my 10th post so i will post the other three KK hands next.

Why not log in now and talk about hands before you go to play so you don't have that added distraction?

**Senguin** · 06-12-2009 05:39 PM

Ok other than the all in preflop KK vs AKs, here are my KK hands that i was upset about it. Please let me know if i should be more aggresive or what? The first two are against the same guy, and he is crazy and wild, calling almost everything.

Full Tilt No-Limit Hold'em, $0.05 BB (9 handed) - Full-Tilt Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com

Button ($0.56)
SB ($1)
BB ($9.03)
UTG ($5.24)
UTG+1 ($4.59)
MP1 ($2.69)
MP2 ($2.81)
Hero (MP3) ($4.95)
CO ($1.87)

Preflop: Hero is MP3 with K

, K

2 folds, MP1 bets $0.15, 1 fold, Hero raises to $0.50, 4 folds, MP1 calls $0.35

Flop: ($1.07) 10

, 2

, 4

(2 players)
MP1 bets $2.19 (All-In), Hero calls $2.19

Turn: ($5.45) 7

(2 players, 1 all-in)

River: ($5.45) 6

(2 players, 1 all-in)

Total pot: $5.45 | Rake: $0.36

Full Tilt No-Limit Hold'em, $0.05 BB (9 handed) - Full-Tilt Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com

CO ($1)
Button ($1)
SB ($8.95)
BB ($5.12)
UTG ($4.37)
UTG+1 ($5.38)
MP1 ($3.07)
Hero (MP2) ($4.64)
MP3 ($5.54)

Preflop: Hero is MP2 with K

, K

1 fold, UTG+1 calls $0.05, 1 fold, Hero bets $0.25, 5 folds, UTG+1 calls $0.20

Flop: ($0.62) 10

, 6

, 4

(2 players)
UTG+1 checks, Hero bets $0.62, UTG+1 calls $0.62

Turn: ($1.86) 3

(2 players)
UTG+1 checks, Hero bets $3.77 (All-In), UTG+1 calls $3.77

River: ($9.40) 8

(2 players, 1 all-in)

Total pot: $9.40 | Rake: $0.62

and then this last one had a drawy board so i was being a little cautious on it!

Full Tilt No-Limit Hold'em, $0.05 BB (8 handed) - Full-Tilt Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com

BB ($0.99)
UTG ($6.10)
Hero (UTG+1) ($4.59)
MP1 ($5.46)
MP2 ($6.22)
CO ($4.40)
Button ($4.81)
SB ($4.31)

Preflop: Hero is UTG+1 with K

, K

1 fold, Hero bets $0.15, 2 folds, CO calls $0.10, Button calls $0.15, 2 folds

Flop: ($0.52) 4

, 5

, 7

(3 players)
Hero bets $0.35, 1 fold, Button calls $0.35

Turn: ($1.22) 8

(2 players)
Hero bets $0.95, Button calls $0.95

River: ($3.12) 8

(2 players)
Hero bets $1.25, Button calls $1.25

Total pot: $5.62 | Rake: $0.37

Any comments would be appreciated!

**JKDS** · 06-12-2009 06:21 PM

hand 1: cooler, u run bad :P He'll do this with JJ, QQ, and even 99 and AT sometimes which offset the tiems he does it with a set.

hand2: i have a hard time thinking utg limps overpairs here, so a likely preflop range is 22-99, A2s+, A8o+, K8s+, sc's, and some suited broadways. of these, i dont really see alot of it hitting hard enough to be continuing for a pot sized bet.

what i mean is, 66, 44, and 33 will call u down till river betting like this. AT might, and sc's might. everything else folds, even like KT to the turn overbet. so if we ask ourselves whats calling the flop bet...

we get 3c4c, 4c5c, 7c8c, 8c9c, tt, 66, 44, AT. which we have 50% equity against. with a small edge, im more inclined to bet smaller and try to get hands like KT other draws to call like closer to .50c.

on the turn, the overbet changes the range to
3c4c, 4c5c, tt, 66, 44, AT , which we still only have a small edge against.

granted, 50% equity is 50% equity, and you're never wrong getting it in with that, but i feel that we could choose to bet slightly smaller and get weaker hands to call more often. ie, i dont know if AT is calling 100% of the time on the turn and this one hand being in villains range is where are edge comes in.

hand 3 im strugglin with. post this one in mirc

any reads on any players?

06-12-2009 02:06 PM #1
Senguin View Profile View Forum Posts Private Message Join Date Jan 2009 Posts 19	KK has not been working out for me Well i can't post any hands yet, it says i have to have 10 posts first. So i'll just say the last 4 hands of KK have been horrendous. Only one of them has been up against anything -- AKs, and i lost with an A onthe flop. the other ones were against chasers, hitting rivers for two pair, one straight, and the other hit a set when he hit turn and river of one of his cards. That is a $10 swing in my small bankroll. How do you handle that when your bankroll is small. That's like at least a couple of weeks earnings.

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06-12-2009 02:27 PM #2
Luco View Profile View Forum Posts Private Message Still a fish Join Date Mar 2009 Posts 2,307	1/ It's an incredibly small sample size 2/ Your bankroll should be built to withstand these inevitable swings 3/ Don't start allowing this to influence the way you play KK in future, unless you're already doing it wrong.
	Originally Posted by spoonitnow Worse doesn't call, better doesn't fold, blah blah same shit different day.
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06-12-2009 03:35 PM #3
JKDS View Profile View Forum Posts Private Message Join Date Feb 2008 Posts 4,300 Location Chandler, AZ	what is your bankroll? what stakes are you playing?

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06-12-2009 04:37 PM #4
Senguin View Profile View Forum Posts Private Message Join Date Jan 2009 Posts 19	On Full Tilt i have around $113 now, and was at $125 after the beats. I'm playing 5NL. I have more money on other accounts but i like to have each one play like their own bankroll.

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06-12-2009 04:45 PM #5
JKDS View Profile View Forum Posts Private Message Join Date Feb 2008 Posts 4,300 Location Chandler, AZ	ya, kk. dont sweat it. you're bankroll is large enough to handle swings like that and you'll recover in no time so long as you arent doing silly things. as soon as you can though, you should post some of those hands in this thread because i have a feeling that they arent all coolers. some likely are, but whenever i lose a large amount of buyins (like the 8 i did recently) i can usually find a bunch of things that i shouldnt have been doing.

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06-12-2009 04:47 PM #6
Senguin View Profile View Forum Posts Private Message Join Date Jan 2009 Posts 19	Just 3 more posts and i'll be posting some hands. One hand was all in preflop, KK vs AKs. Not much i can do about that.

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06-12-2009 04:49 PM #7
JKDS View Profile View Forum Posts Private Message Join Date Feb 2008 Posts 4,300 Location Chandler, AZ	Originally Posted by Senguin Just 3 more posts and i'll be posting some hands. One hand was all in preflop, KK vs AKs. Not much i can do about that. right, this would be one of the coolers although betsizing might be an issue (doubt it). also... http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...08-t67665.html ^^go there, and do that.

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06-12-2009 05:34 PM #8
Senguin View Profile View Forum Posts Private Message Join Date Jan 2009 Posts 19	Ok got Mirc up and running, i'll probably log onto it tonight when i play. also this is my 10th post so i will post the other three KK hands next.

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06-12-2009 05:37 PM #9
spoonitnow View Profile View Forum Posts Private Message Best Strat Poster 2012 Join Date Sep 2005 Posts 10,097 Location Trying to FUNCTION	Originally Posted by Senguin Ok got Mirc up and running, i'll probably log onto it tonight when i play. also this is my 10th post so i will post the other three KK hands next. Why not log in now and talk about hands before you go to play so you don't have that added distraction?

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06-12-2009 05:39 PM #10
Senguin View Profile View Forum Posts Private Message Join Date Jan 2009 Posts 19	Ok other than the all in preflop KK vs AKs, here are my KK hands that i was upset about it. Please let me know if i should be more aggresive or what? The first two are against the same guy, and he is crazy and wild, calling almost everything. Full Tilt No-Limit Hold'em, $0.05 BB (9 handed) - Full-Tilt Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com Button ($0.56) SB ($1) BB ($9.03) UTG ($5.24) UTG+1 ($4.59) MP1 ($2.69) MP2 ($2.81) Hero (MP3) ($4.95) CO ($1.87) Preflop: Hero is MP3 with K, K 2 folds, MP1 bets $0.15, 1 fold, Hero raises to $0.50, 4 folds, MP1 calls $0.35 Flop: ($1.07) 10, 2, 4 (2 players) MP1 bets $2.19 (All-In), Hero calls $2.19 Turn: ($5.45) 7 (2 players, 1 all-in) River: ($5.45) 6 (2 players, 1 all-in) Total pot: $5.45 \| Rake: $0.36 Full Tilt No-Limit Hold'em, $0.05 BB (9 handed) - Full-Tilt Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com CO ($1) Button ($1) SB ($8.95) BB ($5.12) UTG ($4.37) UTG+1 ($5.38) MP1 ($3.07) Hero (MP2) ($4.64) MP3 ($5.54) Preflop: Hero is MP2 with K, K 1 fold, UTG+1 calls $0.05, 1 fold, Hero bets $0.25, 5 folds, UTG+1 calls $0.20 Flop: ($0.62) 10, 6, 4 (2 players) UTG+1 checks, Hero bets $0.62, UTG+1 calls $0.62 Turn: ($1.86) 3 (2 players) UTG+1 checks, Hero bets $3.77 (All-In), UTG+1 calls $3.77 River: ($9.40) 8 (2 players, 1 all-in) Total pot: $9.40 \| Rake: $0.62 and then this last one had a drawy board so i was being a little cautious on it! Full Tilt No-Limit Hold'em, $0.05 BB (8 handed) - Full-Tilt Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com BB ($0.99) UTG ($6.10) Hero (UTG+1) ($4.59) MP1 ($5.46) MP2 ($6.22) CO ($4.40) Button ($4.81) SB ($4.31) Preflop: Hero is UTG+1 with K, K 1 fold, Hero bets $0.15, 2 folds, CO calls $0.10, Button calls $0.15, 2 folds Flop: ($0.52) 4, 5, 7 (3 players) Hero bets $0.35, 1 fold, Button calls $0.35 Turn: ($1.22) 8 (2 players) Hero bets $0.95, Button calls $0.95 River: ($3.12) 8 (2 players) Hero bets $1.25, Button calls $1.25 Total pot: $5.62 \| Rake: $0.37 Any comments would be appreciated!

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06-12-2009 06:21 PM #11
JKDS View Profile View Forum Posts Private Message Join Date Feb 2008 Posts 4,300 Location Chandler, AZ	hand 1: cooler, u run bad :P He'll do this with JJ, QQ, and even 99 and AT sometimes which offset the tiems he does it with a set. hand2: i have a hard time thinking utg limps overpairs here, so a likely preflop range is 22-99, A2s+, A8o+, K8s+, sc's, and some suited broadways. of these, i dont really see alot of it hitting hard enough to be continuing for a pot sized bet. what i mean is, 66, 44, and 33 will call u down till river betting like this. AT might, and sc's might. everything else folds, even like KT to the turn overbet. so if we ask ourselves whats calling the flop bet... we get 3c4c, 4c5c, 7c8c, 8c9c, tt, 66, 44, AT. which we have 50% equity against. with a small edge, im more inclined to bet smaller and try to get hands like KT other draws to call like closer to .50c. on the turn, the overbet changes the range to 3c4c, 4c5c, tt, 66, 44, AT , which we still only have a small edge against. granted, 50% equity is 50% equity, and you're never wrong getting it in with that, but i feel that we could choose to bet slightly smaller and get weaker hands to call more often. ie, i dont know if AT is calling 100% of the time on the turn and this one hand being in villains range is where are edge comes in. hand 3 im strugglin with. post this one in mirc any reads on any players?

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