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JeffreyGB
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05-16-2007, 08:45 PM
Post subject: Identifying and Exploiting the "Information Bet"
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#1 (permalink)
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Jenks, OK
Posts: 3,477
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I'd like some thoughts on the above. I'm basically starting this as a stub thread - I'm still investigating my own thoughts on the matter, so I'll expand them once I have them.
What I can say is that I think there are likely enough players past a certain level who know when to bet for information that it should be profitable to identify them. Once that identification is made, it should be pretty easy to answer their "Where am I at?" bets with "I have you killed."
Discuss.
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Rondavu
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 3,053
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Standard stuff. guy bets weak into you on flop, raise him hard with any two. Sometimes they like calling and min betting into you on turn as well.
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It's not what's inside that counts. Have you seen what's inside?
Internal organs. And they're getting uglier by the minute.
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JeffreyGB
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Jenks, OK
Posts: 3,477
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Rondavu
Standard stuff. guy bets weak into you on flop, raise him hard with any two. Sometimes they like calling and min betting into you on turn as well.
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Agreed, but that's more of an "attacking weakness" play than I intended. I meant more along the lines of a bet someone like a poster at FTR would make to get information.
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jyms
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Tilting Mod
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 4,836
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Rondavu
Standard stuff. guy bets weak into you on flop, raise him hard with any two. Sometimes they like calling and min betting into you on turn as well.
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Yea, what he said. Sometimes you'll get the smart ass that pulls the weak bet/reraise as his smart ass play, but just write a note and next time he weak bets I start f'ing with him more.
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JeffreyGB
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Jenks, OK
Posts: 3,477
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So we're saying that the only exploitable information bet is a weak bet?
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Miffed22001
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Straight Flush
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Marry Me Cheryl!!!
Posts: 8,181
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in terms of an info bet, im thinking along rondavu's line. I often think of it as a donk bet when someone leads oop when it looks like we missed the flop or if the flop is dangerous and they think we might not felt a marginal hand.
I just make note these players do this and also note how marginal they stack off then hit the auto raise button. Sure, they'll turn up with a hand sometimes but the amount they lose to your aggression more than offset's that.
In other words, in cash games aggression is your friend and calling stations your atm's so let them 'bet for information'
If anything, an info bet is an early street blocking bet and they should mostly intend to fold to a raise anyway or push if they are addicted to tp oop.
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swiggidy
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Waiting in the shadows ...
Posts: 3,777
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by JeffreyGB
So we're saying that the only exploitable information bet is a weak bet?
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Most "information bets" are weak. If someone bets just under 1/2 the pot on the flop, that's weak. If they're betting 1/2-full it looks like a value bet.
The only exception would be an overbet, which you need a big read on to push over. (FWIW, This is from a micro-stakes perspective)
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(\__/)
(='.'=)
(")_(")
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Da GOAT
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Straight Flush
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Dublin
Posts: 4,308
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Does information betting really extend beyond the flop tho??
Jeff made the point of when would a FTR/2+2 member make such a bet. the thread so far has focused on donks leading OOP but we all know how to deal with them.
Personally im finding it hard to think of an example. Will think about it tho.
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Jman: every time the action is to you, it's an opportunity for you to make the perfect play.
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LordVTR
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3-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Leaving the building.......thank you very much
Posts: 104
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swiggidy wrote:
Quote:
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Most "information bets" are weak. If someone bets just under 1/2 the pot on the flop, that's weak. If they're betting 1/2-full it looks like a value bet
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Agreed that this is the case most of the time, esp at lower stakes. I will sometimes use a 1/3 pot size bet if I have a strong hand such as a flopped top set on a non drawy board and I'm up against a LAGG who likes to pounce on weakness. It also offers good pot odds for those who may have hit something like middle pair and may get more money in the pot than checking, which everyone may check behind, or value betting 1/2 to full pot when every one may just fold.
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Lord VTR
Grant me the strength to accept the things I cant change, the courage to change the things I can........and the wisdom to know the difference.
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Warpe
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Moderator
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Canuckistan
Posts: 3,905
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by JeffreyGB
I meant more along the lines of a bet someone like a poster at FTR would make to get information.
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We're usually betting for other reasons, information being a byproduct.
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Rondavu
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 3,053
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You have to determine whether an opponent is balancing their lines effectively. Sometimes an opponent will bet half pot with a monster, get raised and push over for a fold, and feel this is sufficient enough to balance their weaksauce feel bets for the future.
Bottom line is that it's a math game. If someone bets weak when weak too often you keep stealing from them, and let them have one here and there. If someone bets weak when strong too often play drawing hands in position against them. IE call with more suited connectors for deep enough stacks.
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It's not what's inside that counts. Have you seen what's inside?
Internal organs. And they're getting uglier by the minute.
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Miffed22001
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Straight Flush
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Marry Me Cheryl!!!
Posts: 8,181
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in other words, good players dont info bet, they value bet or small bet to 3bet.
bad players info bet and fold to aggression, especially multistreet
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