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spoonitnow
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05-28-2008, 09:57 PM
Post subject: How to Play Different NL Hold'em Hands For Total Newbies
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#1 (permalink)
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Straight Flush
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: IRC Chat Room
Posts: 5,406
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The following is a thought I had on the nature of the way new players learn NLHE in terms of structure and the order of things that are learned. Some people would argue that the real basics are hand reading, understanding ranges, betting, and so on, but a complete newbie can't understand those things with no understanding of their context. And so I present the following, which I believe is the beginning of the learning process for most new players, broken down into a structure that I think is easy to understand and grow out of when the time is right.
For the complete newbie's purposes, there are three kinds of No-Limit Hold'em hands that will often continue past the flop. Combined with some starting hand requirements that come from an understanding of position, after the newbie learns how to play these three types of hands, not only am I pretty sure they could beat up to 10nl at the very least, but they've started cultivating the skills needed to play NLHE well in general:
1. Small-mid pairs that hit sets
2. Top pairs battling draws and vice versa
3. Everything else
1. Small-mid pairs that hit sets
We want to be getting good implied odds on the stacks of our respective villains, which usually means around 20:1 or so if we're just against one person, and 15:1 or so against more than one person. If we hit a set then we want to start getting it in, etc. The easiest hands to play. Post-flop is similar to top-pair type hands that score two-pair or better.
2. Top pairs battling draws and vice versa
This is where an understanding of outs and pot odds and implied odds first come in, along with semibluffs. When we have a draw, we want to put money in if we think we'll have an edge based on the odds and we want to get out if we don't. When we have the top pair or overpair type hand, we want to be betting enough to try to give the other player bad odds, etc., but without over-betting the pot or whatever.
3. Everything else
This is where we learn how to continuation bet with missed overs and other topics. Hand type #2 will make us better at hand reading which will make us perform better at this hand type when we have pairs that aren't top pair. This is the hardest hand type for newbies because it's hard to play without some kind of understanding of what's going on. Eventually, this is the type of hand that will make us better at putting people on ranges and "playing poker".
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Ripptyde
I only have 2 simple rules when I am coaching a new student.
Rule # 1: don't ask questions
Rule # 2: don't ask questions
I have no interest in discussing strategy with a protege'. Your job is to remain quiet and listen. I have a very systematic approach that I will share with the right candidate and I promise that I will turn you into a force of nature and show you elements of the game of poker that you never knew existed.
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Robb
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06-05-2008, 02:08 AM
Post subject: Re: How to Play Different NL Hold'em Hands For Total Newbies
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#2 (permalink)
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 3,072
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by spoonitnow
3. Everything else
This is where we learn how to continuation bet with missed overs and other topics. Hand type #2 will make us better at hand reading which will make us perform better at this hand type when we have pairs that aren't top pair. This is the hardest hand type for newbies because it's hard to play without some kind of understanding of what's going on. Eventually, this is the type of hand that will make us better at putting people on ranges and "playing poker".
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Two of my Spoony favs: Spoon's Good Example of When to Cbet and A Good Example of When Not to Cbet.
This post didn't get any love. I checked it when it was posted, and thought vnh. Noobies should be reading and thinking about this. Hell, I reread it and rethought about it. Profitably.
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sarbox68
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Full House
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: wondering where the 3 extra chairs at my 6max table came from
Posts: 871
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Super ninja re-bump...
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spoonitnow
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Straight Flush
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: IRC Chat Room
Posts: 5,406
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The point of the model is that every NLHE topic that complete beginners need to learn falls neatly into one of the three "types" of hands. After those skills are learned (which includes putting opponents on ranges and being aware of what your range seems to be) then the thought process changes a bit, but this model doesn't bog the newbie down too much like others I've seen (Aok's for instance).
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Ripptyde
I only have 2 simple rules when I am coaching a new student.
Rule # 1: don't ask questions
Rule # 2: don't ask questions
I have no interest in discussing strategy with a protege'. Your job is to remain quiet and listen. I have a very systematic approach that I will share with the right candidate and I promise that I will turn you into a force of nature and show you elements of the game of poker that you never knew existed.
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Robb
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 3,072
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by spoonitnow
The point of the model is that every NLHE topic that complete beginners need to learn falls neatly into one of the three "types" of hands. After those skills are learned (which includes putting opponents on ranges and being aware of what your range seems to be) then the thought process changes a bit, but this model doesn't bog the newbie down too much like others I've seen (Aok's for instance).
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And for those of us who are new, but not complete noobies, we often need to just get back to basics. Think about how simple poker is, down in its soul. Think big picture. Hell, just think, dammit!!
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Good post. Shit, when I started to play poker, my knowledge (or lack thereof) was all over the map. It's just been the past two years or so where I've actually put it all together and stopped 'gambling' and started learning how to play real, actual poker.
AOK's 19 hand strategy is a great model but someone should re-write the strategy to where you can play SC's, suited Aces, belly-busters, etc. depending on your position and situation (stacks sizes, opponent styles, etc.). I thought about doing it myself, but eh, I'm too new 'round these parts and prolly seen as a newb, so whatever.
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Robb
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 3,072
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Originally Posted by Mezza Morta
Good post. Shit, when I started to play poker, my knowledge (or lack thereof) was all over the map. It's just been the past two years or so where I've actually put it all together and stopped 'gambling' and started learning how to play real, actual poker.
AOK's 19 hand strategy is a great model but someone should re-write the strategy to where you can play SC's, suited Aces, belly-busters, etc. depending on your position and situation (stacks sizes, opponent styles, etc.). I thought about doing it myself, but eh, I'm too new 'round these parts and prolly seen as a newb, so whatever.
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Interesting you should mention that. LoL. I'm probably trapping myself on this hand, and probably should consider the preflop fold, but my 888th post has been under construction for four months now and will do pretty much what you just said, targetting a start at 10nl for complete noobies. Should be up by Sunday.
Even fnord claimed "noobie for life" status a coupla months back, so don't worry about owning the "noobie" tag. I just like the adjective "winning" in front of my noobie title 
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Quote:
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Interesting you should mention that. LoL. I'm probably trapping myself on this hand, and probably should consider the preflop fold, but my 888th post has been under construction for four months now and will do pretty much what you just said, targetting a start at 10nl for complete noobies. Should be up by Sunday.
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Sweet, saves me the hassles of writing it and getting stoned. 
I'm sure you've read the NLHE section in DB's Super/System on how to play specific hands, so I will expect nothing but perfection. Should be a good piece though, can't wait to read it.
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sarbox68
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Full House
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: wondering where the 3 extra chairs at my 6max table came from
Posts: 871
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Mezza Morta
Sweet, saves me the hassles of ... getting stoned. |
Dude... what crunk you on???
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Robb
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 3,072
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by sarbox68
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Mezza Morta
Sweet, saves me the hassles of ... getting stoned. |
Dude... what crunk you on??? |
I think he means stoned in the Biblical sense, but I LoLd.
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AFchung
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Full House
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: UCLA
Posts: 1,179
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Robb
Quote:
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Originally Posted by sarbox68
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Mezza Morta
Sweet, saves me the hassles of ... getting stoned. |
Dude... what crunk you on??? |
I think he means stoned in the Biblical sense, but I LoLd. |
LOL the biblical sense. a funny (and correct) way of putting it xD
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Haha, yeah, I meant 'stoned' as in getting stoned to death (see capital punishment).
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capital_punishment
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sarbox68
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Full House
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: wondering where the 3 extra chairs at my 6max table came from
Posts: 871
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Mezza Morta
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Dude... ain't nobody in history ever gotten stoned to death... they doze off long before then.......
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Hardy har har. I see we have a comedian in the house.
Anyway, getting back to spoon's post... ah, who am I kidding, I have nothing more to add.
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HarleyGuy13
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Full House
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Oregon
Posts: 1,226
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Another worthwhile bump imo.
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"You start the game with a full pot o’ luck and an empty pot o’ experience...
The object is to fill the pot of experience before you empty the pot of luck."
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Originally Posted by XxStacksxX
Do you have testicles? If so, learn to bet like it  |
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