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'how to play' certain hands

  
 
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nish81
Old 08-24-2009, 06:34 PM     Post subject: 'how to play' certain hands #1 (permalink)  
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hi there BC

so I see quite a few posts/people saying things like 'if you know how to play suited aces postflop' or 'if you can play suited connectors post flop' from time to time. my (possible dumb, but arent they all) question is, what is meant by this? are there some new tricks you have to learn in order to play Axs postflop? or suited connectors? isn't the basic premise of ranges/equity/ev the same?

I know that these hands are different from playing, say, AQ that hits TPTK or a JJ overpair to the board. I guess they rely more on implied odds? And I remember someone telling me (I think it was stax?) that hands like a 12 out combo draw have relatively similar equity across a wide range on the flop, so it's best to get the money in while your equity is stable?

But I don't have a full understanding of how playing these hands postflop is different. and not just sc's or Axs/Kxs, also maybe things like TT underpairs or total trash.

Basically what I'm trying to ask (and i've finally gotten around to it) is where/how do I learn 'how' to play these hands postflop? is the best way to search for threads made about such hands (like this one) or is there something more to it?
<JustinSKS> Tha'ts why I fold my 33 to 72o, because 7 high beats, 1 pair, donk.

JR: lets do it JUAN
JR: mono e mono
JR: man to man
JR: HU4ROLLZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ
Dealer: juan0984 folds
 
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kmind
Old 08-24-2009, 07:05 PM #2 (permalink)  
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 I think a ton of people that make money have a lot of preflop mistakes. You have to adjust your preflop ranges according to each villain. Have good reasoning to play each hand. There are a lot better spots to play suited connectors than others. There are a lot better spots to play Axs hands than others. You need to be more specific. Come up with hypothetical spots and jot down why or why not you want to be playing a certain hand and if you want to be raising or calling with it.
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Stacks
Old 08-24-2009, 08:33 PM #3 (permalink)  
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 What I assume is meant when people say "if you know how to play it", is to understand your hand relative hand strength in relation to your villains range strength. Basically, if you are limping behind limpers with A2s, and flop an Ace, just because you have top pair doesn't mean you have a very strong hand. As you will recognize it's likely a B range hand. That's all I can pull from "if you know how to play it" statements.
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settecba
Old 08-24-2009, 09:23 PM #4 (permalink)  
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Dont know if youve read this before or not. If you have, rereading it wont hurt. It is relevant to what stacks told you about the equity of a big draw and it is also a great article by ISF:

http://poker-strategy.flopturnriver....-Made-Hand.php
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Vinland
Old 08-24-2009, 09:23 PM #5 (permalink)  
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Quote:
I know that these hands are different from playing, say, AQ that hits TPTK or a JJ overpair to the board. I guess they rely more on implied odds? And I remember someone telling me (I think it was stax?) that hands like a 12 out combo draw have relatively similar equity across a wide range on the flop, so it's best to get the money in while your equity is stable?

But I don't have a full understanding of how playing these hands postflop is different. and not just sc's or Axs/Kxs, also maybe things like TT underpairs or total trash.

Basically what I'm trying to ask (and i've finally gotten around to it) is where/how do I learn 'how' to play these hands postflop? is the best way to search for threads made about such hands (like this one) or is there something more to it?
This is how I look at it....not exactly the poker bible here but this is how I look at.
Its going to be table dependant obviously....
For Ax (suited or not) hands, I dump them in EP/MP but if I am in LP and have say one or two pussycats who limped in before me I may raise these hands to take blinds or just call looking to either hit a flush draw or just hope to chase one player away after the flop comes and they show passivity....the key for me is to have position with these hands. If a straightforward limper checks the flop, I am confident to bet out and take the pot down...It's table/player dependant...I'm just looking to win blinds and take flops with cbets....

As for playing 99 or TT type hands I think its easier to know where your hand strength is....
Lets say you raise with a TT and get one caller who is loose passive and folds immediately on the flop when he doesnt hit TP+...you can win a lot of flops with these players...
If a K comes on the flop and you cbet and he calls, you quickly know that you will "probably" not win this hand...and you stop putting money in...
Imagine though just limping with K5 and the flop comes with a K. You bet at the pot and he calls. You put him on a K again....so now what? Does he have <K5? Or >K5? You won't know...
Its tough to bet for value or call for showdown here...Thats why these hands are tough to play for me and I try to avoid it.

I am horrible with suited connectors and tend to not play them much....this is b/c at 5nl and 2nl, unless you are up against real maniacs, the betting shuts down when the 3rd card to a flush comes...and you tend to not get paid enough for all the times you limp in and the flop comes up rainbow...
There have been a few cases where I will play them when I know the villains in the hand will provide some decent fold equity should I wish to bet strong with the flush draw...or just try and win with air...
Again, I like to have position with this hand.

Thats what my limited experience has shown me with these hands.
I confess in quicksand
 
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Stacks
Old 08-24-2009, 09:46 PM #6 (permalink)  
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 Also what I said about draws is directly from ISF's blog, which is that they have relatively stable equity across a varying range; however, have varying equity through different streets. I would explain it, but ISF does a better job in that article than I ever could.
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nish81
Old 08-25-2009, 02:23 PM #7 (permalink)  
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thank you muchly for the replies. the ISF article that was linked to is great, i think i'll read some more of his stuff, maybe i'll understand it more now.


Quote:
understand your hand relative hand strength in relation to your villains range strength.
this makes a lot of sense too
<JustinSKS> Tha'ts why I fold my 33 to 72o, because 7 high beats, 1 pair, donk.

JR: lets do it JUAN
JR: mono e mono
JR: man to man
JR: HU4ROLLZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ
Dealer: juan0984 folds
 
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