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How to control and win this table?

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Papa Georgeo

06-22-2004, 08:47 PM Post subject: How to control and win this table?

#1 (permalink)

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Hey there,
I need some advice on how to control and win a weak table a play at. Im playing with the same people all the time and for the most part im a rookie and a weak player but they are also. The game is a low stakes no-limit hold'em game. Usually around 6 people. Most players will call most of the time and usaually never raise. The type of players at the table are: (All are weak).
- A maniac type player, very loose and likes to bluff.
- Tight player, folds alot. Calls mostly and raises small.
- A chaser/caller will usually try to stay in the pot until the river unless hes got terrible cards. Doesnt raise unless hes got something good. (top pair or better) bluffing is minimal.
- A raiser not too tight but not that loose player. Bluffing rarely.
- A tight player folds alot.
And im the 6th i try to play a tight aggressive game but the maniac has been really throwing me off.
Any advice on seating and how to control the table would be highly appreciated.

Thanks.

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Fortune 500

06-22-2004, 09:44 PM

#2 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Jun 2004

Location: Bluffalupagus

Posts: 1,261

That's a tough table. I think the key here is to play your position. Simply put: Play only your primo cards from early position, do your best to keep the maniac on your right so you can follow him rather than risk a lot of reraises (my personal strategy... others may differ.) If you're in late position, see who's still in the pot, and play accordingly. It's such an eclectic mix of styles that I think you're really going to have to play tight, see who's in, and adapt from there.

Fnord

06-23-2004, 01:26 AM Post subject: Re: How to control and win this table?

#3 (permalink)

Moderator

Join Date: Dec 2003

Location: I'll Do You Like A Truck

Posts: 19,333

Fnord is an unknown quantity at this point

Sounds like you got them pretty much nailed already. Execute.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Papa Georgeo

- A maniac type player, very loose and likes to bluff.

You want position on him to isolate him. Be more inclined to slow play and call.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Papa Georgeo

- Tight player, folds alot. Calls mostly and raises small.

Give him position. Chase with pot odds to take avantage of his small bets.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Papa Georgeo

- A chaser/caller will usually try to stay in the pot until the river unless hes got terrible cards. Doesnt raise unless hes got something good. (top pair or better) bluffing is minimal.

Value bet him to death. Be less inclined to call. Never pure bluff him, even if it costs small pots.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Papa Georgeo

- A raiser not too tight but not that loose player. Bluffing rarely.

Best player so far, avoid him. When you do lock horns, bluff him a little.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Papa Georgeo

- A tight player folds alot.

Give him position. Be more inclined to bluff him.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EBvge-c2_Xg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w-Xz8aLuD7Y

Papa Georgeo

06-23-2004, 03:41 AM

#4 (permalink)

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Posts: n/a

Thanks alot thats exactly the kind of answers I was looking for.

A quick question: On this website it specifies the preflop groups of cards ( group 0 group 1) Would you want to bet more or less as the higher group (worse the cards). I know if you have pocket aces your not going to want to fold everyone with a very large raise but say if you have pocket 9s would you try to fold as many people as possible in order to have more probablitly to win the hand and therefore put in a really big raise?

Thanks again.

maxxscam

06-23-2004, 04:22 AM

#5 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Apr 2004

Posts: 734

pocket 9's is limp or small raise with me, too susceptible to other hands, hit trips or get out with pocket 9's or less, on a full table anyways

other people may play them differently, pocket 9's is my nemesis hand actually, last 3 multis table tourneys i got deep into i have been knocked out with that hand

Papa Georgeo

06-23-2004, 05:15 AM

#6 (permalink)

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Posts: n/a

What if you are on the button and everyone checks do you try to take the hand preflop and if anyone trys to be the sheriff you know that youve got a medium pair all ready giving pretty good odds to beat him?
So far pockets have been evil to me. Ive gotten pocket aces and was so excited i tryed slow playing it ending up losing to trips. Next time i had it i didnt raise enough i guess and was forced to fold when to 4 hearts came up on the board.
My pair of 4s too hit the set on the flop and then try to slow play it and lost again to a flush.
I was thinking of just taking the pot pre-flop just to be safe.

Thanks.

maxxscam

06-23-2004, 06:34 AM

#7 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Apr 2004

Posts: 734

yeah if you are button raise to try and take it down.
at least i do
anytime alot of people see the flop and i have hit trips and there are 2 of same suit or even a potential straight, i always throw a decent raise out there, alot of people like to slowplay trips but its tto dangerous when lots of people see the flop

michael1123

06-23-2004, 07:36 AM

#8 (permalink)

4-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Jun 2004

Location: Rochester Hills, MI

Posts: 1,720

With a hand like pocket aces or trips at the flop, you have to pay attention to if there's a flush draw (2 of the same suit) or a straight draw possibility on the flop (particularly if there's 3 cards in a row on the board). If there is, you shouldn't slow play. Bet the size of the pot at least, and at least in that case they're going against their odds of hitting, since a flush draw only has a 35% chance of hitting, and a open ended straight draw has less.

You'll still get calls often, and sometimes they'll hit and you'll lose a lot. But if they're only hitting 1/3 of the time, and they're having to pay 1/2 of what the winner gets, you'll be winning in the long run.

If there isn't a draw on the flop, particularly with trips, you can slow play. Just keep an eye on the turn, to see if a draw hits there.

A full house is really the hand that you can slowplay to your hearts content and barely ever lose with.

Note ... I didn't say never - http://www.flopturnriver.com/phpBB2/...pic.php?t=1085 :-/

Anyway, when I first started playing, slowplaying too much was one of my biggest weaknesses, along with calling with mediocre hands preflop (i.e. A3 off suit) and getting beat by kickers, so I know what you're talking about with big hands getting beat often when you slowplay. You learn to recognize when slowplaying is appropriate and when you're likely to be outdrawn. Pocket aces, for example, should never be played too slow, because anyone could easily hit two pair. You don't need to go all in immediately, but you should be making big bets with a pocket pair that's higher than the top card on the board, especially since its more likely that their hand will improve (top pair plus the kicker has 5 outs to beat you) than yours will (you only have 2 outs to hit the set).

Papa Georgeo

06-24-2004, 09:47 PM

#9 (permalink)

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Posts: n/a

Hey Ive just had a game that didnt go so successful.
I was playing a really tight game limping in with low pairs and suited connectors and folded the rest getting really small pots. Although when I hit pocket kings i raise big of course the maniac calls and i keep raising him when the flop hits J 5 7 he calls i raise again turn is an 8 i raise he calls river is a 9 and he goes all in i call thinking hes bluffing, he flips over a 10 3 and pulls a straight. Something like this happened almost every time it was getting really frustrating.

Anyways Ive heard when you think your getting unlucky your not playing good enough, so i need some advice on how to play NL low stakes hold em poker (home games), I keep hearing a tight aggresive player is usually the strongest in this type of game so i would like to keep that game plan.

Does anyone know of good book that good help me on this.

Anyone know of any good sites.

And could an experienced player (I know theres alot here) post some hand histories while playing this type of game with about 5-8 players just so i can see how its supposed to be played.

Thanks alot.

P.S. Any tips would be highly appreciated as well.

keyser5

06-25-2004, 04:22 AM

#10 (permalink)

Join Date: Jun 2004

Posts: 26

i agree with the idea of not slow-playing aces. just last night ive got a decent chip lead in my home game (5 players left). i get dealt aces on the button, raise the pot 4xBB so ive only got two callers, one being the BB (big stack). flop comes 8c-Ah-5d. not really worried about the wheel considering my pre-flop raise, so i check-call. turn brings a 10c. BB bets, next guy calls, i raise, BB calls, other guy folds. turn brings a 2h. BB goes all in, i call, he was holding 3c-4c. if i had shut him out on the flop and taken it right there he never wouldve saw that club and stayed in the hand with a flush/straight draw. there was already a good amount in the pot and i never put him on 3c-4c when i raised 4xBB ($80). i got greedy and wanted more, and ended up getting chopped down hard and never really recovering.

as far as low-limit home games i think the solid player is the best. playing only premium hands, rarely chasing unless odds are in ur favor, but also playing the hands that u do play aggressively seems like a good formula. at my weekly home game the winners are usually either myself, my buddy who is also tight-aggressive, and a maniac whos just plain crazy but when he gets chips and power its lights out. a good book to read is "Championship No-Limit and Pot-Limit Hold'em" by T.J. Cloutier and Tom McEvoy. both seem to be preachers of patience, dicipline and observation, setting traps but knowing when to go for it. its a good read at about $25.

"The greatest trick the devil ever pulled was convincing the world he didn't exist....And like that, POOF! He's gone."

Karsk

06-25-2004, 03:59 PM

#11 (permalink)

Join Date: May 2004

Posts: 75

you did the right thing. raised big preflop and made him pay. how big were you raising him after the flop? He had low chances of getting the card he needed and you made him pay to see the cards.. right play in my mind.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Papa Georgeo

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