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How can I avoid getting busted by larger pocket pairs?

  
 
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Shadowskills
Old 08-29-2005, 07:56 PM     Post subject: How can I avoid getting busted by larger pocket pairs? #1 (permalink)  
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How can I avoid getting busted by larger pocket pairs? Any suggestions?

I'm AK74M

Table 16 - 60/120 - No Limit Hold'em
Seat 1: subversion x (5,370)
Seat 2: MACHINE777 (8,090)
Seat 3: AK74M (2,177)
Seat 4: flipp5 (5,803)
Seat 5: barer38 (2,661)
Seat 6: brad0205 (5,100)
Seat 7: sixpackmac (125), is sitting out
Seat 8: perm22 (3,400)
Seat 9: Aotearoa (4,325)
brad0205 posts the small blind of 60
sixpackmac posts the big blind of 120
The button is in seat #5
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to AK74M [:Jd: :Js:]
perm22 folds
Aotearoa folds
subversion x folds
MACHINE777 folds
AK74M raises to 420
flipp5 calls 420
barer38 folds
brad0205 folds
sixpackmac folds
*** FLOP *** [ ]
AK74M bets 1,757, and is all in
flipp5 calls 1,757
AK74M shows [:Jd: :Js:]
flipp5 shows [:Ac: :As:]
*** TURN *** [ ] []
barer38: nhs
*** RIVER *** [ ] []
AK74M shows two pair, Jacks and Fours
flipp5 shows two pair, Aces and Fours
flipp5 wins the pot (4,534) with two pair, Aces and Fours
AK74M stands up
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 4,534 | Rake 0
Board: [ ]
Seat 1: subversion x didn't bet (folded)
Seat 2: MACHINE777 didn't bet (folded)
Seat 3: AK74M showed [:Jd: :Js:] and lost with two pair, Jacks and Fours
Seat 4: flipp5 showed [:Ac: :As:] and won (4,534) with two pair, Aces and Fours
Seat 5: barer38 (button) didn't bet (folded)
Seat 6: brad0205 (small blind) folded before the Flop
Seat 7: sixpackmac (big blind) folded before the Flop
Seat 8: perm22 didn't bet (folded)
Seat 9: Aotearoa didn't bet (folded)

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drmcboy
Old 08-29-2005, 07:57 PM #2 (permalink)  
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 what's the pre flop action like?
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DaNutsInYoEye
Old 08-29-2005, 08:05 PM #3 (permalink)  
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You're obviously over playing your mid-high PPs. More information (ie. hand histories) would be the best way to get more specific advice.
TheXianti: (Triptanes) why are you not a thinking person?
 
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Shadowskills
Old 08-29-2005, 08:51 PM #4 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DaNutsInYoEye
You're obviously over playing your mid-high PPs. More information (ie. hand histories) would be the best way to get more specific advice.
Hand histories inserted.
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EricE
Old 08-29-2005, 09:06 PM #5 (permalink)  
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One expects a re-raise PF from the player with AA. He didn’t do that because he is trapping. Only opportunity to gain more info is on the flop. A bet rather than and AI will gain some info. If you bet large, he still may flat call it. If you bet small or check, he will very likely bet which gains you some info.

In this same spot I will bet the pot (or a little under) on the flop. If he calls I do it again on the turn. With a reraise (on the flop) I’ll have to re-evaluate what he holds. No PF re-raise so I may put him on a set or an overpair. At that point Id be careful and look for a cheap showdown or fold depending on further action. I can’t say that I would definitely get away from this one but I may depending on how he played it.
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The_Cheat
Old 08-29-2005, 09:58 PM     Post subject: Re: How can I avoid getting busted by larger pocket pairs? #6 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shadowskills
How can I avoid getting busted by larger pocket pairs? Any suggestions?


IF YOU READ ONLY ONE POST IN THIS THREAD, READ MINE




aight homeboy, I will make this simple so please pay attention:

do not bet 1,700 chips AI into a 1,200 chip pot when you catch no piece of anything. If you are gonna drop the hammer like that, be sure you have the cards to back it up. No way is that bet gonna get any respect. You push that into me on that flop and this is what i am thinking, "the only hands that have my AA beat are, 44, 33, 77, 74, 73, and 34" you can pretty much count out the 73, and 34, and unless there is a guy at your table named "Rippytide" then you can count out the 74 too, (and if there is a guy at your table named "rippytide" you were screwed to begin with) and on the flop, the 44, 33, and 77 dont push that flop. they check raise your ass. So thats the easiest call in the world for the aces.

My point is this, you put more chips at risk than you stood to gain in a situation where the only possible callers would be those who had you dominated. The reward was not worth the risk in that situation, do you see why?
Don't Hate the Playa, Hate the Cheat

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Originally Posted by a500lbgorilla

The english prefer tea and crumpets. Americans prefer to kick your ass.

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Shadowskills
Old 08-30-2005, 03:39 AM     Post subject: Re: How can I avoid getting busted by larger pocket pairs? #7 (permalink)  
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Thanks for the tip. What would you suggest to bet on the flop? 1/2 the pot, 1/4 of the pot, no bet at all?

Thanks again!


Quote:
Originally Posted by The_Cheat
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shadowskills
How can I avoid getting busted by larger pocket pairs? Any suggestions?

IF YOU READ ONLY ONE POST IN THIS THREAD, READ MINE

aight homeboy, I will make this simple so please pay attention:

do not bet 1,700 chips AI into a 1,200 chip pot when you catch no piece of anything. If you are gonna drop the hammer like that, be sure you have the cards to back it up. No way is that bet gonna get any respect. You push that into me on that flop and this is what i am thinking, "the only hands that have my AA beat are, 44, 33, 77, 74, 73, and 34" you can pretty much count out the 73, and 34, and unless there is a guy at your table named "Rippytide" then you can count out the 74 too, (and if there is a guy at your table named "rippytide" you were screwed to begin with) and on the flop, the 44, 33, and 77 dont push that flop. they check raise your ass. So thats the easiest call in the world for the aces.

My point is this, you put more chips at risk than you stood to gain in a situation where the only possible callers would be those who had you dominated. The reward was not worth the risk in that situation, do you see why?
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The_Cheat
Old 08-30-2005, 06:43 AM #8 (permalink)  
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that situation usually calls for a medium sized feeler bet. 1/3 of the pot or so is how i like to roll.

a reraise from a taggy player means your pwned.
a smooth call from a tappy player means your pwned.
a reraise from a laggy player means your in a good shape.
a call from a lappy player means your in good shape.
a fold means you win the pot.
Don't Hate the Playa, Hate the Cheat

Quote:
Originally Posted by a500lbgorilla

The english prefer tea and crumpets. Americans prefer to kick your ass.

-'rilla
 
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Shadowskills
Old 08-30-2005, 07:56 AM #9 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The_Cheat
that situation usually calls for a medium sized feeler bet. 1/3 of the pot or so is how i like to roll.

a reraise from a taggy player means your pwned.
a smooth call from a tappy player means your pwned.
a reraise from a laggy player means your in a good shape.
a call from a lappy player means your in good shape.
a fold means you win the pot.
What do you mean by taggy, tappy, laggy, and lappy?
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IJGrieve
Old 08-30-2005, 10:39 AM #10 (permalink)  

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Tight Aggressive
Tight Passive
Loose Aggressive
Loose Passive

In that order.
There's a highway to the edge
Once a night, you will drive yourself there
At the end of the road you will find the answer
At the end of the road you will drink the fear
(Hall Of Mirrors - The Distillers)
 
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The_Cheat
Old 08-30-2005, 09:09 PM #11 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IJGrieve
Tight Aggressive
Tight Passive
Loose Aggressive
Loose Passive

In that order.
thanks for typing that out cause i didnt want to. I will break those down a little more signifigantly:

the first "modifier' is tight or loose. this refers to how often and with what holdings a player will call your bets. tight obviously calls fewer bets than loose.

the second modifier is passive or aggressive. this refers to how often and with what holdings a player voluntarily puts money into the pot, and to a lesser extent how much. an aggressive player bets more frequently than a passive player.

so a tappy player is one who doesnt call much, and doesnt raise much either, and a laggy player is one who calls a lot and bets a lot.

examples of laggy players are Soupie, Radashack, Rippytide, Myself, and Michael1123

examples of Taggy players are... i dunno, ILikeAces86, Fnord maybe... not too sure. these are players you can sit with for hours and not even notice really...

Lappy players are your calling stations.

nobody is really a tappy player unless they are playing outside their roll. this is your scared money player who wont put any chips in ever
Don't Hate the Playa, Hate the Cheat

Quote:
Originally Posted by a500lbgorilla

The english prefer tea and crumpets. Americans prefer to kick your ass.

-'rilla
 
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