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straight167
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07-03-2005, 08:33 PM
Post subject: hit and run
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#1 (permalink)
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Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 62
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when do you guys usually leave? I try to leave with +$100 if not then I will play until I have +$50 left and if I dont fill up the 2nd rack then I leave with $50. (Not bad for like...30 min of work) If I do get to fill the 2nd rack, woot. More power to me! I know some people who just won't leave even if they are up +$150, $200 and end up loosing their profit+BR
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mgobluefb
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Straight
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 172
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I've done hit and runs before, but usually I end up staying at a table for a pretty long time - 1-3 hours.
Just the other day, I sat down in 50NL, and in the first two hands I took two people out. Then I left.
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Final Gauntlet Standings: 5th, Money Won: $128.97, Points: 195.30
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BIGandRICH
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Flush
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Jazz Club
Posts: 419
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I dont think of it in terms of + so many $$$. its in BB because i play different limits.. so i like to have +20-40BB before i will leave. If i'm on a huge run and up a few hundred BBs.. then i just keep going.. why waste your stack advantage?? I leave when i either stop playing a winning game or when i have to leave because i need to do something else.
I made one hit and run once.. when i wasnt concerned as to whether i won anything in the session.. i only had about 10 mins. so i went in tripled up on the second hand and left it there.
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villain goes AI
i call with a set (i have him owned)
i win pot
villain: **** this, this site is bullshit, ******* rigged, suck out ****
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m3laNcholy
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Straight
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 232
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I never put goals for $$ and when to leave a table/end the session.
If I am doubled/tripled at a table I wont leave unless I am ending the session. Its just stupid.
I usually 3-4 table at NL $100 for 4-6 hours/session and usually average 2-3 buy-ins/session.
Sometimes I will sit down open my tables and have a remarkable run of cards/luck/stupid opponents etc end end up at +$200 or so in like half an hour. Thats the only time when I hit and run. When I make $200 in half an hour I dont want to know "what happens next". I might end up +$500 or back to where I started, but hey its $200 in half an hour! I just end the session and call it a day where I did nothing and made good money, I go out for a drink or sth and play the next day.
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koolmoe
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Full House
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Drowning in prosperity
Posts: 1,279
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Sounds like you're talking about B&M play ("fill up the second rack").
I usually go with a predetermined amount of time that I will play, and I only leave early if the games aren't good.
There is so much involved in getting to the poker room that I am very reluctant to not put in a full session unless it is obvious that I am being outplayed.
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Poker is freedom
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journey075
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Full House
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 725
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i go all-in on the first hand and if i win i quickly run away. also, everybody likes me.
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ville18
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Straight
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Yo mama
Posts: 223
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by journey075
i go all-in on the first hand and if i win i quickly run away. also, everybody likes me.
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I don't. YOU SUCK112426ONEONETWOSIX##!
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kdm3nac3
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Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 21
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by ville18
Quote:
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Originally Posted by journey075
i go all-in on the first hand and if i win i quickly run away. also, everybody likes me.
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I don't. YOU SUCK112426ONEONETWOSIX##! |
lol, I think he was making a joke but I hate people like that too.
My experience has shown that when I win big and stay to try to win more I lose b/c I get carried away and start playing a little bit looser.
Now thats my weakness and at this point trying to work on it.
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I h8 online poker.
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Miffed22001
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Straight Flush
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Marry Me Cheryl!!!
Posts: 8,181
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I try to have a predetermined amount of money that i want to win for that session. As soon as i get near this target or over it i quit. If that takes 3 hands or 3000 i dont care so long as i make this target. Basically it means i know what im trying to do with my poker when i sit down to play every session.
I find it also means i can just forget about poker at times and have a feel good factor knowing that im hitting the targets im setting. I know this shouldnt affect my play but it helps when you get a beat that you know every other day that week you've hit a target that you set.
basically i try to have 2.5 times my buy in but anything above doubling my buy in after an hours play will make me leave.
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What's the point in leaving? Treat your poker as a life-long session. You're just post-poning the next hand. Unless you're planning on SPENDING that money elsewhere.
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kdm3nac3
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Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 21
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by iopq
What's the point in leaving? Treat your poker as a life-long session. You're just post-poning the next hand. Unless you're planning on SPENDING that money elsewhere.
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so when do you leave?
unless your good enough to take out everybody at the table I dont see the cycle ever ending.
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I h8 online poker.
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I leave when I want to leave. Like when my ass is numb or when I want to go to sleep. Or if I want to have dinner.
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underminedsk
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Flush
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Reraising you from the button
Posts: 250
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If you are a winning player, I dont understand why you would want to leave a table before you had to. If I build a stack at a table, Im less likely to leave, not more, because now with chip lead I can fully destack anyone at the table.
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online br: $14,000, @400NL full ring, 100NL 6 max
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storm75m
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Flush
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: 6MAX-NL - Houston
Posts: 401
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An article from PokerPages.com
Ace Speaks: The truth about hitting and running
by Rolf Slotboom
In this column, I have written quite a lot about hit-and-run follies, about the silliness of quitting the game when you've won, say, one or two buy-ins. There are quite a few players who regularly hit-and-run, and who believe they are doing the right thing. For the professional player, the concept of quitting while you're ahead doesn't make much sense, though. It doesn't matter if you play now, or quit and come back the next day, because it's all one session anyway. In fact, you might cost yourself money by leaving early, because for every hour at the table you figure to get paid: the more hours, the more money. Deciding factors in whether or not to continue playing should be:
Is the game still as good as it was before?
Are you still mentally and physically able to play your A-game? which adds up to;
Do you still have positive expectation?
Most hit-and-runners have a very high percentage of winning sessions, but an hourly rate that's a lot less spectacular. This is because they might have nine (relatively small) wins in a row, only to lose back all of their winnings on day # 10. Then, they simply cannot quit the game anymore simply because they're stuck, even though at this point they are by no means favorites to beat the game. (This might be because they are playing a lot worse than usual, because they are playing against good or even excellent players, or because game conditions are unfavorable- for instance, when the rake is simply too high for the type of game they are in).
Having said all this, I get accused of hitting-and-running myself quite often. When I scoop a big pot in my regular pot-limit Omaha game, it is not unusual to hear some of my fellow players make comments like: "OK, so you did it again. See you tomorrow. Seat open!", fully expecting me to leave the game soon. Just a few days ago, when there was no pot-limit game available and I chose to play in a juicy $10-20 hold'em game, I got lucky by winning two medium sized pots in only one hour of play. I was up maybe $200 when to my dismay, a few of the weaker players decided to leave the game to get some sleep. When there were just five players left, I decided to quit the game as well, because it was a raked game (making short-handed play unattractive), because it was unlikely the game would fill up again, and because the people who had stayed were all playing fairly decent.
In short: I figured my edge in this game would be small- if there was any edge for me at all. It was when I picked up my chips, that the gentleman on my left -a very nice and friendly player, someone who is almost never out of line- said to me: "Ace, I thought you were different. But you are just another hit-and-run player. I saw you do it a few days ago, and I see you do it now. In my casino, we ban players like that." I was surprised when he said that- not just because he had always been so nice to me in the past, but also because of the silliness of his statement. I know not a single regular hit-and-runner who is more than only a marginal winner in poker- not one of the top professionals I know thinks this system is of much use. If I were a regular hit-and-runner, I would never have been able to make as much money as I have. Also, that $200 I won on this particular night may have been a decent win for only one hour of play, it is nothing to become thrilled about for me: on a normal night, in my regular pot-limit game, I figure to do a lot better than that. But more than this, why wouldn't anyone like to play against people who hit-and-run? You never lose big against them, because whenever they have scooped a nice pot, they are out of there. But when they are most likely to be playing badly (when they are stuck, trying to get their money back) they simply cannot leave- even though their future expectation may have become negative, rather than positive. Thus: when they are likely to be playing well and are winning, they leave and when they are down, stuck or steaming they keep on playing- now why on earth would you ban players like that? The truth about hit-and-run is this:
Hit-and-run in limit poker.
In limit poker, hitting-and-running is simply a silly concept. When you are in a good game, playing well and are a favorite to beat the game, there's no reason to leave no matter how much you're winning or losing. In limit poker, the winning player gets paid by the hour- the more hours, the more money. Hitting-and-running will be beneficial to your percentage of winning sessions, but not to your hourly rate and certainly not to the total amount of money you will have won at the end of the year. That is all there is to it: when you have an edge, you play- when you don't, you don't. Now what could be simpler than that?
Hit-and-run in pot-limit poker.
In pot-limit poker, there is something more to consider, though. In pot-limit, the size of your stack in relation to the blinds and to the size of your opponents' stacks is very important. Because you may lose your entire stack on one hand, having a big stack may be a reason for you to leave- especially when there are dangerous, aggressive and / or experienced pot-limit players on your left, who are playing a big stack also. In pot-limit, it is important to be aware of your abilities, but of your limitations as well. A lot of players -myself included- are much better playing a short or medium stack than playing a big stack. Now if you think the danger of you losing your stack is quite high, and you might therefore be not so much of a favorite in this game anymore, then you should simply quit and come back the next day. Leaving with a win here wouldn't be the same as hitting-and-running though, even though your opponents will judge it as such. Also, it is a frequent occurrence in pot-limit that whenever I win a big pot one or two opponents are busted because of this. When they decide to leave and better players take their seats, or the game becomes short-handed, then I often quit and call it a day. But once again, this has got nothing to do with hit-and-run. Any player that quits the game simply because he's up a certain amount cannot be a good player, if you ask me. Despite everything you think you see or notice, hit-and-run players are not doing the right thing- and they certainly are not long-term winners JUST BECAUSE OF THIS STRATEGY. In my opinion, that's all there is so say about hitting-and-running; there's simply nothing more to it.
Take care, you guys, and good luck.
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Lack of Discipline and Over-Confidence... The root of all poker evil.
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straight167
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Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 62
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I rarely bluff in limit hold' em. However, I tend to play any suited cards (play more loose) when I'm up and they ADD up pretty fast.
I'm just saying...I mean even if you win $50 a night and you do that 5 times a week.That's $250 a week...
$1000 a month.
Play only premium hands and win one big pot an hour. That's it.
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dalecooper
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Sep 2004
Posts: 3,107
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Playing any suited cards in limit is a good way to waste a lot of money. You might be winning at a faster rate if not for that. Suited connectors are one thing, but any suiteds - terrible idea. At least in no limit you can use implied odds and the possibility of bluffing as a cushion for loose pre-flop calls. In limit this is suicide.
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Checkways
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Straight
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 249
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I don't have a maximum win total because a big stack is so powerful and I want to have the best of it. Also, poker is a life long session as someone pointed out earlier. However, I do have max loss total. If I lose three buy ins I know I'll get diminshing returns. My game just won't be as sharp if I've already lost a lot of money.
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DoGGz
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Miffed22001
I try to have a predetermined amount of money that i want to win for that session. As soon as i get near this target or over it i quit. If that takes 3 hands or 3000 i dont care so long as i make this target. Basically it means i know what im trying to do with my poker when i sit down to play every session.
I find it also means i can just forget about poker at times and have a feel good factor knowing that im hitting the targets im setting. I know this shouldnt affect my play but it helps when you get a beat that you know every other day that week you've hit a target that you set.
basically i try to have 2.5 times my buy in but anything above doubling my buy in after an hours play will make me leave.
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This is exactly the mindset you don't want.
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kdm3nac3
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Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 21
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i say play till you feel you dont have an edge over the other players anymore.
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I h8 online poker.
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Miffed22001
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Straight Flush
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Marry Me Cheryl!!!
Posts: 8,181
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 All day today then
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