Originally Posted by journey075

1.) i woulda put all my chips in before the river. the chance he has something that beats top pair after 7 cards isnt bad. i would probably have pushed on the turn if i decided i was going to tie myself into the hand. however, i would probably have slowed down and checked the turn. not a terrible play but you do realize after 7 cards you have one pair on a straight board. the guy was an absolute moron though.

2.) two pair vs set, youll probably lose money every time. but something to think about...calling doesnt necessarily indicate weakness. it also represents strength. it says 'you cant push me out of this hand, i belong in here just as much as you.' i would have bet two pair the same but once again, getting married to one pair is never a good idea.

3.) you have a very weak hand here. what hand is going to call you that you have beat? only hands that will call are ones with a Q or ones with an A. i say you are either looking to tie or lose this pot. i would check/fold this one if ever given a sign of strength and since none was given id be happy to see a free showdown.

i agree with you that players this passive are annoying to play with. just make value bets (not all in after 7 cards with a pair) when you think youre ahead and youll be fine. youre not a terrible player by any means.

Originally Posted by drmcboy

On the last hand why are you betting once the second A comes - what do you think he called you with on the flop? It's bad luck but this is now a pretty easy fold. No way your hand is good there. Why would he raise with the nut full (or quads as it turned out) - giving free cards is good here. Seems like you thought the second A was a good card, but I'm not sure why.

PS if you bet the river and he didn't raise, he's the worst player ever.

Originally Posted by drmcboy

Makes sense. Don't beat yourself up too much, getting started is hard for two reasons:

1) You're learning to play correctly, but everyone makes mistakes, newbs more so.
2) Even playing correctly, bad players will still draw out, especially at lower limits when they aren't smart enough to fold. Just keep making good plays, they won't beat the odds long term. I think the math on the first hand after the turn is you're about a 20 to 1 favorite to win this pot, that's the kind of spot you want to be in!

Originally Posted by bigred

....You knew you were beat with the QQAA board. Playing when you know you're beat is like shooting yourself in the foot.

Originally Posted by drmcboy

Sorry, didn't mean to mis-label you.

I think you'll find most good players move from TAG to a looser, more aggresive strat for exactly the reason big red mentions - namely that playing tight you're either taking the KK vs AA beat (which to me is just as bad as having 88 draw out on the KK) or you take a standard bad beat, almost everytime you lose money. So you wait wait wait then get sucked out. It's actually less painful and more fun to give up on pots where you raise with junk than to watch AA get beat yet again by clueless moron #8 - for me, I guess - that's probably an individual thing. When I get a monter beat it pains me, when someone picks me off on a bluff I can just smile and move on.

Originally Posted by Ro_Joe

Understand bigred....thanks for the help.

and the bad beats keep happening. Here is a hand from tonight.

Table Table 36951 (6 max) (Real Money)
Seat 5 is the button
Total number of players : 6
Seat 1: cheapdotcom ( $24.5 )
Seat 2: grooboggle ( $64.2 )
Seat 3: Stepinfoo ( $14.4 )
Seat 4: Imperial_641 ( $18.5 )
Seat 5: Gilbo125 ( $67.15 )
Seat 6: Ro_Joe ( $24.75 )
Ro_Joe posts small blind [$0.1].
cheapdotcom posts big blind [$0.25].
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to Ro_Joe [ Qd Ah ]
grooboggle calls [$0.25].
Stepinfoo calls [$0.25].
Imperial_641 calls [$0.25].
Gilbo125 raises [$1].
Ro_Joe calls [$0.9].
cheapdotcom folds.
grooboggle folds.
Stepinfoo calls [$0.75].
Imperial_641 folds.
** Dealing Flop ** [ Jh, Ks, Tc ]
Ro_Joe checks.
Stepinfoo checks.
Gilbo125 bets [$3].
Ro_Joe calls [$3].
Stepinfoo is all-In [$13.4]
Gilbo125: wow that was quick
Gilbo125 folds.
Ro_Joe calls [$10.4].
** Dealing Turn ** [ 6h ]
** Dealing River ** [ Kd ]
Ro_Joe shows [ Qd, Ah ] a straight, ten to ace.
Stepinfoo shows [ Kh, Th ] a full house, Kings full of tens.
Stepinfoo wins $31.9 from the main pot with a full house, Kings full of tens.

I'm thinking I should have gone all in after seat 5 raised 3, but since I flopped the straight I could raise on the turn. Well it backfired.