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A few things I have noticed at 2nl - for noobs

  
 
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Vinland
Old 05-19-2009, 09:59 PM     Post subject: A few things I have noticed at 2nl - for noobs #1 (permalink)  
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 Having made it through 2nl recently I thought I would post some random thoughts in case any new FTR 2nl noobs drop buy. These are general points that I've collected while playing there ...None of this is ground breaking but here it is in one post. Some people may disagree, thats ok.....I'm not an expert by any stretch.

-On the flop, players will call inside str8 draws, OESD and Flush draws with improper odds quite often, especially in multiway pots. I was surprised how often a player would call a pot sized bet with an inside straight draw...when you are on the turn with these players, you cant assume they arent on a draw just because you presented them a bet that SHOULD have shut the hand down.

-value betting is key. Bet your good hands, check the weak ones and dont worry about becoming transparent...no one notices. If you are applying yourself and thinking, taking notes etc....you are doing more work than all the other players combined.

-Cbet lots. Especially the weak players. I have HEM, and there will be players with 20/1/.5 stats. They are weak....they only bet/raise with the nuts... I cbet these guys religiously and they just cant call. I remember a hand where a nitty/weak player opened in EP with a raise and I called w/ 99, just us heads up. The board came JXX (x was low). He checked which told me he didnt have a high pocket pair so I figured he had AK, AQ something like that and figured the J was no help to him. I bet out and he thought for a while....typed the box that he had QQ and folded....nice fold sir....well done.

-while you are there, you will run into some semi-regs. I had about 7 players with over 200 hands logged on each of them. They all had the same thing in common Their stats looked something like this 18/1/1. There was some variation, one player had 5/2/.5 and one has 20/1/1, I can remember one player having 18/0/1. They are limping in with decent cards perhaps raising with KK+ only. I called an EP raise knowing he had me crushed but I had 55. I hit the set, he shoved the flop and I doubled through his AA. This leads to the next point:

-Players dont bet properly...they have 2 pair, are miles ahead at the moment w/ 2 others in the pot and they are betting 2 cents into a 20 cent pot. When new player say they win small pots and lose big ones....heres why. It happened to me when I started out.
I bet the same way for all my opening hands (4bb + 1/limp) unless I had a monster in the button/SB and it folded to me. If the BB was a nit or weak, I bet smaller...Another thing you will find are players who will raise 10-20bb from EP. This often was the top holdings. I really believe they are afraid....they dont want to get drawn out on and they bet that so that a) everyone folds or b) if they get sucked out on they can tell themselves "what a bad player for calling that bet". They dont give themselves the chance to make any $$ when they have a hand...they are worried only with NOT losing. This is why you will will be playing in 5nl soon and they will still be stuck at 2nl with their 6bb/100 win rate.

-I never took a vendetta out on anyone for suck outs. Just keep playing the best you can, which, if you are a reg at FTR will be better than anything you run into at the tables at 2nl. If you raise from MP w/ 66 and get a crappy player who calls from the blinds and the board is in his range and he calls/raises/bets etc....and is still in the hand by the turn....you can lay it down unless you think he's a total knob. Just because the board hit his hand doesnt make him a better player. Knowing you can fold when you know you're beat makes you the better player.

-Get advise from the BC regs. I got nice advise from Illfavour, Boo, Dranger, Stacks, Iopq, Spenda and Robb to name a few. They have all been here, know how to crush it and are passing info to you....soak it in. Put your ego in the backseat...

-If you have gone through a stretch of having decent hole cards that just dont connect, DO NOT change your play....Do not start limping as a way to lose less.....You need to keep raising.....keep being fearless....eventually the losses from pf raises will be more than made up when you hit and get some value. That is one thing you will see from most of the regs here...they play smart but aggressive poker....

-Bets are usually honest. The turn and river shoves are usually honest (not bluffing). You just have to pick out the players who think TPMedK is worth the shove. The few times I called the river shove b/c I couldn't resist, they usually had what I feared. Make sure you have some value.

-I often read threads here discussing how players call down to the river with anything and are willing to go broke with second pair....I actually didnt see that very often. I made it to the river very rarely....players usually folded on the turn and I only occasionaly got to the river with an opponent holding second pair. Thats why you need to bet strong on the flop to make what you can. Dont check very often with made hands if ever.

-Against players with stats like 45/8/3....if you have TPTK, you will usually have them crushed. They bet out too much with weak holdings and will often call preflop with any A (and K) Getting into a hand with them when an A is on board and you have AQ is a special treat that will pad your earnings when they call down w/ A6.

-I commend myself for my patience that I built. I hated the suck-outs and loose calls that worked out for my opponents but you cant have a killer winrate unless they are playing this type of crap. For now, I have taken it in stride...If you play solid cards, and bet them for value, you will get sucked out on but its statistically impossible for KK to lose to 23 in the long run....Lets see if my patience changes as I move up.

-I found, that due to my starting requirements, I very rarely got flushes and straights. I dont mind calling in LP w/ say TJs, it just didnt happen very often. This led me to make the most of my $$ from TP, 2P, and sets with the occosional FH and even a Quad hand. Its the others that chase the draws....charge them, the probabilities are on your side in the long haul.

I could probably go on.....but thats all I can think of. Hopefully someone new here who plans on applying himself will read this and get something out of it.
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Da GOAT
Old 05-19-2009, 10:10 PM #2 (permalink)  
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nice post
Jman: every time the action is to you, it's an opportunity for you to make the perfect play.
 
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dranger7070
Old 05-19-2009, 10:57 PM #3 (permalink)  
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Lol, its so weird for me to be considered a "reg," even if it is just the BC. Glad I could help you out, and nice job on moving up! Hope you have continued success and I better be seeing you at 25nl with me when I get back from boot!
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Micro2Macro
Old 05-20-2009, 02:32 AM #4 (permalink)  
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 nice work, you're definately ready for 5nl. Good luck.
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Old 05-20-2009, 06:55 AM #5 (permalink)  
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nice post
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thejesusfish
Old 05-20-2009, 07:05 AM #6 (permalink)  

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Hi, im a bit of a noob, could you explain what this is?

"-Cbet lots. Especially the weak players. I have HEM, and there will be players with 20/1/.5 stats. They are weak...."

Im guessing Cbet is continuation bet? But what is HEM and what does 20/1/.5 mean?
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TonyB73
Old 05-20-2009, 07:22 AM #7 (permalink)  
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HEM is Hold'Em Manager, which is a stats tracking program, like Poker Tracker.

20/1/.5 refers to the most commonly cited player stats from HEM/PT, which are:
- VPIP (voluntarily put money in the pot %)
- PFR (pre flop raise %)
- AF (aggression factor)

A 20/1/.5 player is very passive - only plays about one pot in five but limps/calls every time, and plays passively post flop.
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bjsaust
Old 05-20-2009, 08:43 AM #8 (permalink)  
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Tbh if you can keep this in mind it will apply fine up through 50nl. Only thing I might think more about as you move up is when to cbet and when not to
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daven
Old 05-20-2009, 12:22 PM #9 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bjsaust
Tbh if you can keep this in mind it will apply fine up through 50nl. and vs fish at any level
extended your post
the ability to quicklz identify the fish becomes more and more important as you move up in stakes
don't raise with the straight flush bro, nobody ever gonna call that shit
allin, reload, repeat

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Illfavor
Old 05-20-2009, 02:41 PM #10 (permalink)  
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 The patience thing cannot be overemphasized.

Nice list, and keep up the good work man.
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