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zxqv8
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04-18-2008, 04:48 AM
Post subject: Equity Question
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#1 (permalink)
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Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 79
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I'm having trouble wrapping my head around a simple scenario despite having read quite a bit about equity in the past.
Suppose that preflop I have a decision put to me to make a call that's 2:1 on my money (like, I have to call $1.5 to win a $3 pot) what equity does my hand need versus opp's likely range of hands to make this call?
I faced a situation earlier where I calculated about 32% equity versus villain's likely range and to call was 2:1 on my money. I made the call and lost, but I'm still not sure if I was terribly wrong to make the call or just slightly wrong. I know I'm beat pf by a considerable margin but versus his likely range I was confused at the time as to whether him giving me 2:1 was good enough for a call because I lack a clear understanding of equity in this sort of situation.
I won't post the hand because I feel it would actually detract from the main point of my question (which I've conveniently bolded in case anyone is confused). People have a habit of focusing on the HH alone and ignoring the rest.
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bjsaust
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Straight Flush
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Ballarat, Australia
Posts: 5,842
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If you're calling PF, then you're not c-betting the flop.
I think you're confusing yourself trying to use terms like equity in a PF situation. Unless you make your hand on the flop, then it sounds like you're probably going to give up, so you need to improve to a winning hand 1/3 of the time on the flop.
I cant see a lot of value in this question though. It sounds like you're talking about an AI situation, but then you talk about postflop actions...
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Just playing to improve.
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zxqv8
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Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 79
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The question is about a PF AI, but the only similar concept I can remember is the cbet concept. I removed it to maybe make things clearer.
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bjsaust
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Straight Flush
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Ballarat, Australia
Posts: 5,842
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Ok, in a cash game its pretty much simple pot odds v's equity.
If you're getting 2:1 on the call, and believe your hand is better than 2:1 v's their range, then you call. Over time, thats a +ev situation. If you think its about even, then go with your gut. In that kind of situation I'd probably be a bit conservative and fold, simply because you think 2 out of 3 times you lose, so if its a 0 ev spot, just fold and save your money now.
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Just playing to improve.
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Robb
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04-21-2008, 07:45 PM
Post subject: Re: Equity Question
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#5 (permalink)
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 3,072
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by zxqv8
Suppose that preflop I have a decision put to me to make a call that's 2:1 on my money (like, I have to call $1.5 to win a $3 pot) what equity does my hand need versus opp's likely range of hands to make this call?
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I don't think you're getting the right advice here. This isn't a straight-up pot odds question. The questions you should be asking are as follows:
1. What are my odds of hitting my hand on the flop (pot odds)?
2. Will villain stack off/pay off if I hit my hand (read/implied odds)?
3. How likely am I to stack off/pay off if I connect with the flop but am still behind (reverse implied odds)?
4. Do I have the type of hand that will play well postflop against villain's likely holdings?
5. How much better am I than villain postflop - can I exploit that advantage in this type of hand (read)?
There is a distinct difference between my #1 and what you stated in bold. Using PokerStove (or similar) to determine equity preflop tells us only what our showdown equity is, the chances of winning if we went all-in preflop. Lot's of hands with good preflop equity suck postflop because they become ridiculously hard to play. AJo is a perfect example of a hand whose all-in equity is MUCH higher than it's actual value in terms of playability.
I know this doesn't really answer your question, but I don't think in terms of straight-up, all-in equity preflop, nor do I worry too much about straight-up pot odds preflop. I worry about reads, about how I will be able to "get away" from trouble flops, about how likely villain is to bet/call when behind, about ranges and tendencies, and about postflop playability.
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