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Enjoying Playing poker vs winning poker

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SuperDave9x19

02-01-2006, 02:02 PM Post subject: Enjoying Playing poker vs winning poker

#1 (permalink)

Straight

Join Date: Sep 2005

Location: Delaware USA

Posts: 114

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I have found my key flaw. I like to PLAY poker.

There is no doubt that profitable poker is different from having a fun time at poker.

Don't get me wrong, I have fun playing poker almost no matter what. But I starrted playing for fun/money 34 years ago and I have a LOT of long held "habits" that for lack of a better term are pretty "pedestrian" by good players standards..

I like to do many of the things that truly work against making money properly.

The only solution I have found to this is to get 2 $$$ tables going and play them properly then play a "Play Money" table and goof off there.

My other solution is to do 6 man tables since with less people you can "play" the game more.

Has anyone else had this same problem and how have you overcome it?

Been playing money poker for 34 years and decided in 2002 to try that TX Holdem game on TV. Then found Pokerstars in Summer 2005. Still not an overall winner but i am on a good trend and nearly there.

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arkana

02-01-2006, 02:26 PM

#2 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Mar 2005

Posts: 1,109

I enjoy making money more than I enjoy goofing around at the table, I know at the lower stakes the money might not be that signficant but if you can grind your way to the top then you can earn nice money while still having fun. I also enjoy outplaying my opponents more than I enjoy getting lucky. Keeping track of your winnings (ideally using PT) is good to keep you focussed and motivated. Set yourself goals and give your best. If you find yourself making dumb plays because you are getting bored then concentrate on getting better reads and\or play more tables (6-max > full ring).

Halv

02-01-2006, 03:26 PM

#3 (permalink)

pro crastinator
4-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Aug 2005

Location: No hindsight for the blind.

Posts: 1,842

I like to play cards as well. My "solution" is my live home game. When playing live with my buddies I will usually loosen up much sooner than I do in online SnG's. I still have some level of discipline, of course, but at this game it's just as much about the social and fun aspect of the game as it is about winning.

Then when I go online I say to myself; "Okay, now let's play some REAL poker.

First music vid: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MFerARdGW04
Free stream of different song here: http://www.nrk.no/urort/artist/wellfear ('Lytt'/play button on right side)

SuperDave9x19

02-01-2006, 06:01 PM

#4 (permalink)

Straight

Join Date: Sep 2005

Location: Delaware USA

Posts: 114

Quote:

Originally Posted by HalvSame

heh. to me "real" poker is about fun. Typically any money I ever won playing poker was burned on booze and food for the night.

But I understand your point. And I try, I really do. Sometimes i loosen up knowing that I am doing it at a table i judge as acceptable for this. But sometimes I do this without realizing it before I get a handle on the table.

Sometimes I play and rock so hard people wonder why I bother playing at the low levels that I do. I guess the low levels give me the ability to let my weakness thru once in a while.

Sappy, but true.

Gareth

02-01-2006, 06:18 PM

#5 (permalink)

Straight

Join Date: Jun 2005

Location: FlopTurnRivered

Posts: 246

I Enjoy Playing Winning Poker

"To see what is right, and not to do it, is want of courage or of principle." - Confucius

donkbee

02-01-2006, 06:42 PM

#6 (permalink)

WELP

Join Date: May 2005

Location: so close but so far

Posts: 3,604

Definitely try playing more tables to see if it eliminates boredom and/or time sitting around doing nothing after you've folded your crappy hands. There's usually something to do when you're playing four tables at a time ... (sucks when you get playable hands at all four tables at once though ... that's where I get killed, lol)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fnord

Why poker fucks with our heads: it's the master that beats you for bringing in the paper, then gives you a milkbone for peeing on the carpet.

aokrongly

02-01-2006, 07:39 PM

#7 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Jan 2005

Posts: 863

The good news Dave, is Most People enjoy Playing poker more than they enjoy making money. And really it's just another type of payoff. When you "work" poker you get paid off with money. When you "play" poker you get paid off with more emotional ups and downs - kinda like people who aren't happy unless they are in "dramatic" relationships. When things settle into a calm, predictable mode they do something to cause some drama. Same thing happens at the poker table with most players. Just about everyone has a point at which they think "This is going too slow" (or something similar if not as obvious like "it's ok to play this suited connector from early position at this table") and they do something to cause action. I consider myself a very disciplined player but after about 90 minutes - especially if I've had to lay down big pocket pairs or other great hands because I know that someone caught up with me - then I want to "get more involved" too. I work very hard NOT to do so.

The problem with playing for the emotional payoff is, in the end, you leave the game with a very negative emotion (losing), and if you do that often enough then you set a baseline expectation of "getting unluckly" eventually in any session. So you start playing to the expection. This is called "perma-tilt". And it's how most of us make money - playing the perma-tilt players, and the emotional rollercoaster riders who are on their way to perma-tilt.

The fact is this. You can believe that "action" is fulfulling or you can believe that "discipline" is fulfilling. If you play poker for the rush then have fun. When you get tired of doing that you KNOW what you have to do already. It's really just a decision you make. Unfortunately, playing "disciplined" poker 90% of the time and "fun" poker 10% of the time is no better than playing "fun" 100% of the time. Don't mislead yourself by thinking that you can do 90/10.

good luck

SuperDave9x19

02-01-2006, 08:17 PM

#8 (permalink)

Straight

Join Date: Sep 2005

Location: Delaware USA

Posts: 114

Well i gotta admit, I NEVER leave a poker session angry or mad. Worst case is i dissapoint myself, but I am harder on myself than anyone so that is something I deal with.

Plus my budget is low enough that I get $50 a month for this. I typically make it thru the month as a kind of expense.

But last nite on the .01/.02 tables I did 3 tables for $5 ea and ended up with $54 between them in 3 hours. One thing about .01/.02... You can be a little sloppy. I had a 2 hour period where (due to the tables relative lack of sense) I saw WAY more pots than usual. My stats were appalling.

But at these sociable tables everyone wanted to see the flop but no one seemed willing to push other people off the pot. As I won I was called the "mega donk" since I thought "crap, I have $18 here, I can pay .02 to see a flop on my 64suited" and it worked quite a bit or failed 10 times for .20 before I pulled in another pot.

I won like 4 HUGE hands where people said WTF are you playing 79 (or similar) for? and i could only respond "To win your stack" ... i didn't want to let them know that they can bet pre flop and eliminate said donkedness.

But i enjoy it win or lose. I simply enjoy winning more.

aokrongly

02-02-2006, 02:24 AM

#9 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Jan 2005

Posts: 863

well, then don't sweat it. Just have fun.

CFANG

02-02-2006, 03:22 AM

#10 (permalink)

Straight

Join Date: May 2005

Posts: 128

I think to sum up what aok said and to agree with him, you need to find "poker zen" so to speak. See "perfect" play not as some chore but as some artform.

or if its just a cheap beer night with friends....bah go nuts and enjoy yerself if thats what you're there for .

andy609

02-03-2006, 08:57 PM

#11 (permalink)

3-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Dec 2005

Location: To the left of the dead money

Posts: 108

I think winning is the most fun. I will say though that I don't mind losing so much in a home game because it's a social event in addition to a money-making opportunity.

salsa4ever

02-04-2006, 01:54 PM

#12 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Jun 2005

Location: Melbourne

Posts: 1,073

playing winning poker is in most cases not that exciting. But it IS satisfying. Not many things you can regularly do are as satisfying as de-stacking somebody.

Let me list all the exciting things I did over a 5 hour session where I won about $800.

I went all in pre flop with AK against a 25BB smallstack (won it)
I went all in pre flop with KK against a big stack (he had KK too)
I made about 20 cont bets (i think i'm ahead on these)
I made one laydown with TPTK+
I spent 20BB+ drawing (to pretty correct odds) twice. I hit once, and
missed once, for a large net gain)
I went all in with AKs on a flush draw + overs flop because
I made one raise bluff with a PP against a suspected cont bet in position with a read on the raiser (won)
I made one river bet bluff when a flush card hit and i was on a straight draw (pulled it off)
I think i looked up one river bluff successfully.

Most of my money was made very mundanely. Like folding bad hands pre flop. Not going after bad draws. Overcharging opponent's draws. As I write this, a fish just went all in for 94BB ($188) with 10.7 against my 10.K (which incidentally I was big blind). I also won nice pots outkicking my opponent's Q3 and 93 (!!) top pairs. Waiting for good cards and playing them correctly.

It's interesting... right now I just played a K9 top pair aggressively but controlled, and folded my opponent... don't know if i was actually ahead or not. Playing multiple tables can help with patience. And there are enough situations where you can do something adventurous in a controlled manner to have fun.

That's it. The other stuff is very

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigred

Would you bone your cousins? Salsa would.

Quote:

Originally Posted by salsa4ever

well courtie, since we're both clear, would you accept an invitation for some unprotected sex?

midas06

02-04-2006, 02:08 PM

#13 (permalink)

4-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Jun 2005

Location: NZ

Posts: 2,196

I don't enjoy losing. At anything

stoltzy

02-04-2006, 04:32 PM

#14 (permalink)

Join Date: Aug 2005

Posts: 37

i just mainly play for fun because im playing low stakes .05-.10 NL and .10-.20 LH, im not a great player and in like 5 months ive turned $50 into $150 so i know im not a money making machine. There nothing wrong with just playing for fun and experience.

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