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Don't build a Big pot and Abandon it...How?

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Zee Devee

12-19-2007, 02:16 AM Post subject: Don't build a Big pot and Abandon it...How?

#1 (permalink)

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Join Date: Sep 2006

Location: Wisconsin

Posts: 694

This guy was a minraising fool preflop. I decided to see what he would do with a 3-bet, and show aggressoin on the flop. I hate my fold on the turn with those odds, but I am pretty sure he will call a raise, and if I call I am only hoping for a J.

I think the main object here is how do I get the pot small so I don't abandon this big pot?

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.10 BB (5 handed) Poker-Stars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver)

BB ($13.45)
UTG ($10.10)
MP ($15.60)
Hero ($13.75)
SB ($9.90)

Preflop: Hero is Button with Q

, K

.
1 fold, MP raises to $0.2, Hero raises to $0.6, 2 folds, MP calls $0.40.

Flop: ($1.35) 7

, T

, A

(2 players)
MP bets $0.4, Hero raises to $1.5, MP calls $1.10.

Turn: ($4.35) 9

(2 players)
MP bets $0.7, Hero folds.

Final Pot: $4.35

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pgil

12-19-2007, 05:35 AM

#2 (permalink)

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to keep it small, stop raising. and don't fold here. getting a little over 6 to 1 with money left to go against someone that you don't feel is capable of folding when you have position.

i think you are giving opp too much credit, and think your K/Q may be outs as well. at least enough to call a river bet from a donkey. I like calling these guys down pretty light on occasion. sometimes it stops them/slows them down, and if it doesn't, then they are even bigger fish than i thought.

"If you can't say f*ck, you can't say f*ck the government" - Lenny Bruce

TLR

12-19-2007, 07:01 AM

#3 (permalink)

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I would not fold here for such a small bet

naturalassassin

12-19-2007, 09:52 AM

#4 (permalink)

Join Date: Sep 2007

Location: Canada

Posts: 59

i agree with pgil. You're making the best bang for your buck by seeing a cheap turn and flop. So calling would be the best option against this type of player. Calling also give the least information in this case. Any card will scare him because he knows he bet weak and you can have just about anything.

I've folded pp in this same scenario many times only to see the turn would have made me a set.

I like the preflop raise to be about $1 in this case because the blinds are still in the pot. Though you're .6 did isolate the mp.

Don't knock on deaths door... ring the bell and run! Death hates that LOL.

Robb

12-20-2007, 02:19 PM

#5 (permalink)

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Your post subject: Don't build a Big pot and Abandon it...How?

1. Fold preflop.
2. Don't rr twice - rr once to show strength, then ease up.
3. Call the river.

When I get in these spots (and I do, all to often), I just grit my teeth and call the river bet. All things equal, I'm generally waiting for a better (postflop) hand to look this guy up with.

Zee Devee

12-20-2007, 02:26 PM

#6 (permalink)

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Robb

Your post subject: Don't build a Big pot and Abandon it...How?

1. Fold preflop.

He is minraising crap like K6s and Q8 too much for me to fold here pf.

Quote:

2. Don't rr twice - rr once to show strength, then ease up.

I 3-bet preflop because I assumed I was ahead. He donkbet led so I raised like it was a c-bet.

Quote:

3. Call the river.

When I get in these spots (and I do, all to often), I just grit my teeth and call the river bet. All things equal, I'm generally waiting for a better (postflop) hand to look this guy up with.

It was the turn. I folded because I didn't think I had adequate outs and he would probably bet again because he has shown enough strength (and more because I showed strength) that makes me think he has an A here.

Robb

12-20-2007, 03:19 PM

#7 (permalink)

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My mistake on river/turn - I should have said "called all the way to the river." And I meant it, if he's still throwing mini-bets around on both streets.

There's a post around the Beginner's forum where Chopper and I discussed the min-raise donkbet. The problem is that some of the noobs don't KNOW it's a donkbet, and it can mean real strength. At NL10, it's hard to tell if the guy's a donkey with air or a complete noob with a great hand. If you think it's a donkbet, why not just call it down to the river a couple of times with decent hands/draws, and see what it means for cheap? Why do you need the 3-bet and rr?

pgil

12-20-2007, 03:51 PM

#8 (permalink)

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I don't mind the 3bet pf or the flop raise, especially if the guy has been minraising a lot of hands, and often. But folding the turn is really really bad. I would probably even call a similarly sized river bet w/ K high just to see what he has. And then I would use that information to extract more from him later.

fwiw, I usually see this as a sort of blocking bet. if he checks to you with his weak holding, you are going to bet, but if you have been FOS the whole time, he might get to showdown cheap (or even get a fold).

"If you can't say f*ck, you can't say f*ck the government" - Lenny Bruce

XTR1000

12-20-2007, 06:11 PM

#9 (permalink)

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3bet more to $1, he´s getting good odds to call preflop.

postflop just take the cheap cards hes offering you, DNBD.

Villian doesnt care what you are representing, he has two cards and thats all what matters to him, dont try to outplay these guys. Wait for your next TPMK/MPTK and take him for a ride to value town.

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigred

xtr stand for exotic tranny retards

yo

Vrax

12-21-2007, 11:26 AM

#10 (permalink)

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He probably has Ace or Ten.

Either make it potsized raise $2.5 if you want to semibluff and think he'll believe you have AK+ (not recommended, lol @ respect in donkstakes) or just call to make your hand. Gutshots are considered "fishy hands" but folding it here is kinda bad, because you have position, nut-draw, lots of money behind and idiot in front who doesn't have any fucking idea about big bet poker. Implied odds are here.

Raising only to $1.5 is taking the worst of both worlds. Your FE is nil and you destroy your implied odds.

"How could I call that bet? How could you MAKE that bet? It's poker not solitaire. " - that Gus Bronson guy

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