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piper
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02-18-2005, 12:20 AM
Post subject: Did I play this hand right?
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#1 (permalink)
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Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 12
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Hey guys,
Newbie here.
I've been playing for about a month on Pacific Poker.
I got sick of all the really dumb stuff on 5cent/10 cent so upgraded to 25 cents/50 cents.
So I'm playing 25c/50c limit poker and get dealt pocket aces. I raise preflop and everyone but one guy folds out. He reraises me, so I reraise back. We raised each other to the limit pre-flop.
Flop = 6 K 8 rainbow.
He has the first play and raises. I call as I am afraid of KK.
Turn = 4 Again he raises and I call.
River = 2. Again a raise and I call.
Was I too passive with this hand?
I won the hand and a decent pot because he was playing pocket tens.
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LeFou
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02-18-2005, 12:41 AM
Post subject: Re: Did I play this hand right?
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#2 (permalink)
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Dallas, TX
Posts: 2,361
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by piper
Flop = 6 K 8 rainbow.
He has the first play and raises. I call as I am afraid of KK.
Turn = 4 Again he raises and I call.
River = 2. Again a raise and I call.
Was I too passive with this hand?
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Confusing. He's not raising but betting, right? I don't think you should have been afraid on the flop. Go ahead and raise him there as any strong king would "fit" with the action.
Called there, I'd check/call the rest. You've either got him beat and the pot's big enough this time, or you don't and the pot's certainly big enough for that. I think that's what you did, except that you said "raise" @ turn and river when I think you meant bet.
Welcome to town.
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piper
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Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 12
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Yeah, he didn't raise when I said, he bet.
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gabe
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Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: trying to live
Posts: 7,964
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way too passive! I raise him every time.
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LeFou
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Dallas, TX
Posts: 2,361
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by gabe
way too passive! I raise him every time.
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You mean you raise every street? You've still just got a pair there
?
Now that I think about it, it would depend on my mood and my impression of the opp. I've sat with a few that I would just cap away all day on. Also sat with some that I'd check-call in this spot.
so, piper, guess what:
it depends.
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gabe
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Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: trying to live
Posts: 7,964
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cap the flop, if you raise the turn, then from there if he calls you, you bet the river, if he raises you call there and call the river.
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JeffreyGB
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Jenks, OK
Posts: 3,477
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I'm going to go against the tide and offer up that you may have played it just right (at least, for the cards he had).
Chances are, if you had reraised with the K on board, he would have either folded or called only to later check/fold. As is, you got the flop bet out of him and the big bets on the turn/river. That said, what I don't like about only calling the flop is that it fails to protect your hand. That said, with this board and the preflop action, I don't think protecting your hand was a big concern (nor did it need to be). My only draw fear would be him with high suited connectors possibly improving from a pair of kings to two pair.
- Jeffrey
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HeavyP
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Straight
Join Date: Sep 2004
Posts: 187
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I'm pushing all my chips in the middle there as fast as I can. k 8 6 rainbow. So Right now you're only worried about KK. since 88 and 66 are not likely. There is no way for you to tell by the way both you and he played this hand if he has AK or KK. You need to show some aggression to find out. You're just trying to win or lose a small pot. When I have AA I try to make the pot as large as possible.
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JeffreyGB
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Jenks, OK
Posts: 3,477
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by HeavyP
I'm pushing all my chips in the middle there as fast as I can. k 8 6 rainbow. So Right now you're only worried about KK. since 88 and 66 are not likely. There is no way for you to tell by the way both you and he played this hand if he has AK or KK. You need to show some aggression to find out. You're just trying to win or lose a small pot. When I have AA I try to make the pot as large as possible.
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Reread the post. He's playing limit. And what about raising as much as possible makes you think someone has AK over KK?
- Jeffrey
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LeFou
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Dallas, TX
Posts: 2,361
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by JeffreyGB
Reread the post. He's playing limit. And what about raising as much as possible makes you think someone has AK over KK?
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I think he just means he's getting as many chips in as he ca, not that he's going all in. And I think he means that since AK is a possibility -- probably as strong a possibility as KK -- There's no real point in slowing down.
Probably right; as I said elsewhere it'd be other considerations that made you slow down (i.e. you want to change image etc.)-- the cards and board don't dictate it.
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RiverMonkey
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Flush
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 446
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Pre-flop cap was great for your hand. AA heads up is a great position to be in ... I think you are a pre-flop 80% or so favourite if I'm remembering that correctly.
I think you absolutely have to raise him on the flop in an attempt find out if he has KK, or a 88 or 66. You need to find out where you stand going into the BB rounds.
If he just calls your flop raise .. I think you have three possible conclusions you can make:
[1] He has a Kx with x not a 6 or 8 - so maybe TPTK or TPGK. This isn't likely given the pre-flop action.
[2] Most likely, I'd put him on a lower pocket pair just from the pre-flop action alone. Maybe Qs, Ks, Js, Ts etc.
[2] He's slow playing a set of Ks, 6s, or 8s ... But I'd give this possibility much less weight than possibility [2].
If he re-raises your flop raise you have to consider the possibility of KK, 66 or 88 and you are up against a set. In which case, I'd likely (as always, it depends) check call to the river. However a re-raise is also a possibility here, but maybe I'm too aggressive for my own good(?). Folding is NOT an option PERIOD! Neither is slow-playing your aces ..... IMHO you should never slow-play top-pair hands.
As always reads should be a very important ingredient in your thinking process. Unless you have a read that this is a tricky player you can't play your AAs scared just because a K flops and he bets out first. Even if you did have this read, you still need to raise the flop! Would you have backed off if the flop had a Q or J instead? See what I mean?
Over the long run, if you assume that the other player has a set of Ks, 6s or 8s the majority of the time in this situation you are going to lose out on bets.
You need to be more aggressive! As they say, 'selective aggression' ... but if you are going to pick a spot to be aggressive, I'd pick having pocket As heads-up any day.
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HeavyP
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Straight
Join Date: Sep 2004
Posts: 187
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by JeffreyGB
Quote:
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Originally Posted by HeavyP
I'm pushing all my chips in the middle there as fast as I can. k 8 6 rainbow. So Right now you're only worried about KK. since 88 and 66 are not likely. There is no way for you to tell by the way both you and he played this hand if he has AK or KK. You need to show some aggression to find out. You're just trying to win or lose a small pot. When I have AA I try to make the pot as large as possible.
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Reread the post. He's playing limit. And what about raising as much as possible makes you think someone has AK over KK?
- Jeffrey |
Just because he's playing limit doesn't mean I can't get my chips in the center fast enough. I also play almost strictly limit.  I wasn't talking about ALL IN. I was talking about betting/raising. I probably should have worded it better.
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piper
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Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 12
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Ok,
So it sounds like the best way to find out how good his cards are is to raise him, and see how he reacts. Raising would also have been a good strategy because I had top pair, so I was fairly safe.
Someone mentioned folding would NOT be an option. So if you have a good hand, but there is a reasonable possibility it could be beat, do you call/check to the end?
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HeavyP
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Straight
Join Date: Sep 2004
Posts: 187
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In limit, people could be betting there draws for value and miss. But keep on the aggression. You could feasibly have the best hand and fold it at the river. Calling the river with a losing hand is a -1BB mistake, Folding a winner at the river is a ~+10BB mistake.
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piper
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Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 12
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So if I've taken a winning hand all the way to the river than I may only need a small bet to try and win a big pot. But if I fold on the river I will have NO chance of winning the pot.
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Greedo017
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Full House
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: wearing the honors of honor and whatnot
Posts: 1,461
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that's a very important thing to remember, think about the size of your mistake. don't bet and bet and bet and get scared on the river and fold to just one more. see people in NL all the time who will put greater than 2/3 of their stack into the pot, then fold when raised the last few bucks on the river. even if they have a crappy hand, that's a huge mistake.
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piper
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Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 12
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Thanks for the tip guys.
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