|
kennyr22
|
07-04-2008, 08:48 PM
Post subject: Developing Non-Showdown Winnings
|
#1 (permalink)
|
|
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 11
|
|
In what ways can you increase your Non-Showdown Winnings? More bluffs or floating? Im having trouble bringing my non-showdown winning graph go up
|
|
|
Play for FREE and practice your game at...
Join the FTR Poker Forum to disable these banners and start posting!
|
|
kmind
|
|
Straight Flush
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Not Giving In
Posts: 4,240
|
|
value bet thinner
|
|
|
|
Ragnar4
|
|
Full House
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Billings, Montana
Posts: 1,284
|
|
Value betting yields showdowns.. from the initial topic I think he doesn't want a showdown.
|
The older I get, the more I start wondering; Just what in the hell is going on here? 
|
|
Muzzard
|
|
4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Cheshire, UK
Posts: 1,843
|
|
Be more agressive
Perhaps change ur standard open raise from 3bb to 4bb
|
|
|
|
kmind
|
|
Straight Flush
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Not Giving In
Posts: 4,240
|
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Ragnar4
Value betting yields showdowns.. from the initial topic I think he doesn't want a showdown.
|
Value betting thinner yields more folds. Most players check behind too much.
|
|
|
|
Ragnar4
|
|
Full House
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Billings, Montana
Posts: 1,284
|
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by kmind
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Ragnar4
Value betting yields showdowns.. from the initial topic I think he doesn't want a showdown.
|
Value betting thinner yields more folds. Most players check behind too much. |
sounds fair.
|
The older I get, the more I start wondering; Just what in the hell is going on here?
|
|
Fnord
|
|
Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: I'll Do You Like A Truck
Posts: 19,333
|
|
Pick on the weak, tend to avoid confrontations against strong players with marginal hands.
|
|
|
|
jyms
|
|
Tilting Mod
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 4,836
|
|
Solving this riddle is easy, how you adjust to winning more showdowns will be a problem. I spent all of the last two weeks trying to adjust, just to stop spewing in non showdowns. I have a new problem.
|
|
|
|
Fnord
|
|
Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: I'll Do You Like A Truck
Posts: 19,333
|
|
I just looked at this graph for my database and was surprised I was up less than a buy-in for non-showdown winnings while over the same period I was up 13 buy-ins for showdown winnings. Given that I've been picking on weak players so much lately it made me think.
Then I realized that folding your SB/BB is a non-showdown loss.
|
|
|
|
bjsaust
|
|
Straight Flush
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Ballarat, Australia
Posts: 5,842
|
|
Yeah, blinds count in your non-showdowns. I'm running about dead even over 7k hands in non-showdown winnings. Wish I could pinpoint my changes, but not folding as much probably helped me.
|
|
Just playing to improve.
|
|
Da GOAT
|
|
Straight Flush
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Dublin
Posts: 4,308
|
|
i wanna see a rly solid players stat
|
|
Jman: every time the action is to you, it's an opportunity for you to make the perfect play.
|
|
Keilah
|
|
Full House
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Northern BC, Canada
Posts: 658
|
|
yo wtf at fold BB being non-showdown loss.
|
|
|
|
spoonitnow
|
|
Straight Flush
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: IRC Chat Room
Posts: 5,406
|
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Keilah
yo wtf at fold BB being non-showdown loss.
|
It's a loss, and it's not at a showdown, so this is pretty straight-forward.
Running about break-even at non-showdown is fine, fwiw, as long as you're up at showdowns.
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Ripptyde
I only have 2 simple rules when I am coaching a new student.
Rule # 1: don't ask questions
Rule # 2: don't ask questions
I have no interest in discussing strategy with a protege'. Your job is to remain quiet and listen. I have a very systematic approach that I will share with the right candidate and I promise that I will turn you into a force of nature and show you elements of the game of poker that you never knew existed.
|
|
|
Fnord
|
|
Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: I'll Do You Like A Truck
Posts: 19,333
|
|
Sustainable?
|
|
|
|
Miffed22001
|
|
Straight Flush
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Marry Me Cheryl!!!
Posts: 8,181
|
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by spoonitnow
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Keilah
yo wtf at fold BB being non-showdown loss.
|
It's a loss, and it's not at a showdown, so this is pretty straight-forward.
Running about break-even at non-showdown is fine, fwiw, as long as you're up at showdowns. |
is less than 1bbs/100 acceptable for the nits out there like me? 
|
|
|
|
kennyr22
|
|
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 11
|
|
what are your most prominent strategies for creating these non showdown winnings fnord? nice graph
|
|
|
|
badgers
|
|
4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Spewing
Posts: 3,372
|
|
bluff shove every river obv
|
3k post - Return of the blog!
|
|
a500lbgorilla
|
|
JESUS TAKE THE KEYBOARD
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: This room is a good place to be
Posts: 8,379
|
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by badgers
bluff shove every river obv
|
this is a huge leak since you should be bluff shoving most turns.
|
Smithers, use the amnesia ray.
You mean the revolver, sir?
Precisely.
|
|
badgers
|
|
4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Spewing
Posts: 3,372
|
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by a500lbgorilla
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by badgers
bluff shove every river obv
|
this is a huge leak since you should be bluff shoving most turns. |
this is not as effective since you will inadvertantly suckout and win sometimes.
|
3k post - Return of the blog!
|
|
d0zer
|
|
Moderator
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 2,519
|
|
I managed to get my non-showdown winnings from badly negative to near breakeven by:
Picking better board textures to c-bet / double barrel
Picking better villains to c-bet / double barrel
Being more selective about c-betting/bluffing in general
Floating c-bet bots in position more & punishing their predictability.
Tightening up a little preflop.
The last one worked for me because I was pretty loose preflop and ended up in marginal spots vs loose shortstacks where I c-bet a lot with trash or 2nd pair no kicker and had to give up a lot of raised/cbet pots.
|
|
|
|
bjsaust
|
|
Straight Flush
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Ballarat, Australia
Posts: 5,842
|
|
Great point dozer. I think one problem a lot of developing TAGs have, is they c-bet like monkeys. Learning that its ok to not c-bet when you dont think its good to do so can really help.
|
|
Just playing to improve.
|
|
d0zer
|
|
Moderator
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 2,519
|
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by bjsaust
I think one problem a lot of developing TAGs have, is they c-bet like monkeys.
|
Yes this was me for quite a while. Just insta c-betting with no thought of range, fold equity, board texture, etc...
Definite spew. But having been that way for a while, I understand the mindset of the regs I find with like 80% cbet flop. It's the 50%-60% cbet types I worry more about now. Don't like floating em' so much, but still will with a showdown value type hand.
Exploiting predictable villains is fun 
|
|
|
|
frosst
|
|
Straight
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: count-n mah monies stewie-style
Posts: 220
|
|
steal more blinds and 3bet more preflop
|
|
|
English
Deutsch
Español
Français
Italiano
Nederlands
Pусский
Svenska
05-26-2012, 03:08 PM Australia Legalized Online Poker coming up in next 6 to 12 Months
Linear Mode
