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Deep 20NL TT vs over bet

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  1. #1

    Default Deep 20NL TT vs over bet

    This won't look like a standard HH as it was played on 888 and on the non-download site too.

    Reads. BB is a whale and the reason I'm at this table still and deep. He has 3-bet me and everyone a lot (J9o OOP to someone else previously) and I've narrowed my button raising range accordingly. He plays fast post flop. Donking out, raising a lot of flops and over betting often without hands. The one monster he had was AA limped pre flop, c/call flop, check/ check turn, shove river. Not seen this move before though:

    NL Holdem $0.20
    Btn: Hero ($55)
    SB: ($20)
    BB: ($80)

    Hero dealt T T

    3 folds, Hero raises to $0.80, 1 fold, BB Raises To $2, Hero calls $1.20

    Flop($4.10) 5 9 K
    BB Bets $78 (all in), Hero?
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  2. #2
    lol Fold.
  3. #3
    Definately calling this off
    *edit* also we have outs
  4. #4
    i wouldn't call this vs. anyone.
    Playing big pots at small stakes.
  5. #5
    Shotglass's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Edlets View Post
    Definately calling this off
    *edit* also we have outs
    ^^^WTF?!?!?!
  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by baudib View Post
    i wouldn't call this vs. anyone.
    nit?!
  7. #7
    bikes's Avatar
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    i mean theres no way we can know what to do here as if you are considering calling its because you have v specific reads we dont have.

    id default fold but im guessing since you posted you have reads that say this could possibly be a call

    ?wut
  8. #8
    I posted the reads. I think this is not AA, KK or a set. He slow plays monsters. He could do this with some AK, Kxs, QQ, JJ, any pair. Also AQ, AJ and perhaps some really bad random junk like QJ, A9.

    Of course I could stove that range, but I was wondering whether the bluffs lot/slowplays monsters read would induce anyone to put him on a range that means a call this deep. I.e. with that read, what sort of hand are with holding out for calling these massive lead overbets? Should I wait for a better spot bearing in mind that I am almost always OOP on this table against him
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  9. #9
    Folds. He can do this with bluffs, two pair, aces and K. And fish loves to do it with any of those hands.
  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by gingerwizard View Post
    Not seen this move before though:
    You haven't invested enough here to feel remotely attached to the $4 in the pot imo.

    Also, frankly BECAUSE he's a whale he shows up more often with TP here than with air.
  11. #11
    Miffed22001's Avatar
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    Small pot, lots of money going in, dont have a nut hand or hand strong vs villains range and little invested

    yeah looks like an excellent spot to call - not. FFS
  12. #12
    rong's Avatar
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    Yeah, agree with everyone. I get really frustrated playing people like this because you only have a finite amount of time with him at the table before someone busts him, and it fucks me off when it isn't me.

    But either way, I'm waiting on top pair with a medium kicker before stacking off, ie AT on an Ahi flop or KJ on a Khi flop, as a minimum.
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  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by The Norg View Post
    You haven't invested enough here to feel remotely attached to the $4 in the pot imo.

    Also, frankly BECAUSE he's a whale he shows up more often with TP here than with air.
    It has to do with pots odds and NOTHING to do with how much money you've "invested".
  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Shotglass View Post
    ^^^WTF?!?!?!
    Two-outer plus two backdoors; 2x backdoor draws = 1 real draw ldo.
  15. #15
    ..fold
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  16. #16
    LOL he has K6o
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  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by gingerwizard View Post
    Should I wait for a better spot bearing in mind that I am almost always OOP on this table against him
    Change seats?
    Playing big pots at small stakes.
  18. #18
    Shotglass's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by eugmac View Post
    Two-outer plus two backdoors; 2x backdoor draws = 1 real draw ldo.
    That "wtf" was meant at the 'call it down". Sorry for the confusion.
  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by Shotglass View Post
    That "wtf" was meant at the 'call it down". Sorry for the confusion.

    I know - and I sarcastically said that two backdoor draws = one actual draw.

    edit: and i realize it's not a very good joke, so just let's just forget it and move on eh?
    Last edited by eugmac; 08-09-2011 at 03:50 AM.
  20. #20
    kmind's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rondavu View Post
    LOL he has K6o
    Whoa!
  21. #21
    oskar's Avatar
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    ^^ most likely

    I'm calling this with KQ+
    The strengh of a hero is defined by the weakness of his villains.
  22. #22
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    fold.
  23. #23
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    Although I'm a fish (still only 150k hands but am showing a slight profit but a big profit on 888 after 30k hands). I've played those stakes for about 10k hands.

    Snap fold here.

    Ignoring any read that he is a maniac out for lols (very unlikely), he's 2 pair worst, but more likely a set & he's hoping you've hit TPTK or 2 pair that you can't lay down (There's plenty of them at 888).

    Just wait for a better opportunity and you'll get his stack. These guys do shoves like this all the time and often get more brazen thinking they can bully the table. When you hit top set you can take him down. (imo He didn't get 4 buy-ins being a complete turd - I don't know if fish is necessarily a good title here - shoves like this get called all the time at this site when someone's holding a premium hand).

    I never underestimate unless I have a solid read & notes that say, "Maniac - bluffed 3/10 air on river c/call 2 streets chasing. Solid made hand 50%-70% value bet 2x". I have seen some dumb calls (heck I've made a few dumb calls too in my time) - me thinks this is a lay down for sure! Just note it & watch for a pattern. You can then hit when the time is right.

    Check out the video poker for a chuckle. You can actually get reads on them (and watch them make false reads!). My best lol moment was seeing a guy do fist pumps when he shoved the river (scary card to complete a straight). It didn't add up so I called & sure enough he had complete air - fist pump to show strength = weakness right Mr Caro?
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  24. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by kmind View Post
    Whoa!
    THIS!!!! Where the fuck have you been Rondavu??

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