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Molinero
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07-24-2004, 08:51 AM
Post subject: For Cryin' Out Loud
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#1 (permalink)
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Straight
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: In The General Vicinity of Dallas
Posts: 230
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OK, here it is: I am not wealthy. I can't freaking afford to keep losing $100 bucks a week trying to learn how to play poker. I don't think I'm all that bad at it, but bad beats and bad plays on my part as I learn sure do take a toll.
Should I take a sabbatical and just 'study' for a year or so before I put another dollar into this game? I mean, I'd like to be able to pay rent now and then!
Sigh...
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michael1123
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Rochester Hills, MI
Posts: 1,720
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What stakes are you playing at? Sounds like you're playing a bit over your head right now.
You don't need to give up poker for a year, but I'd stick to the cheapest tables you can play at, or $5 SNGs, until you master those levels and start regularly making money, and building up your bankroll.
But, by all means, keep studying while you're playing at these levels.
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Humphrind
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Kansas City
Posts: 1,887
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by michael1123
You don't need to give up poker for a year, but I'd stick to the cheapest tables you can play at, or $5 SNGs, until you master those levels and start regularly making money, and building up your bankroll.
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I'm gonna combine a little bit of michael and a touch of Rippy to give you my own answer.
Do some SnGs. Stay out of the ring games. If you are learning, ring games are a sure-fire way to go bust quickly. At least with SnGs you can decide how much you want to wager, and that $5 (or whatever) can last you about an hour.
You can also gain a lot of experience through a lot of hands by going into SnGs.
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I don't know what they have to say
It makes no difference anyway.
Whatever it is...
I'm against it.
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FyrFytr998
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Full House
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Milford,Ct.
Posts: 1,412
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And you'd be surprised how far your money can go at the sites with microlimit tables. A .02/.04 table can provide hours of gambling enjoyment.
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AllinLife
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Flush
Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 530
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paradise poker offers 2$NL ring games
UB offers 3+0 Tournaments i think as well
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"Is there any chance I'm going to lay this 9-high baby down? That's really not my style."
- Gus Hansen
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Toasty
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: England UK
Posts: 1,522
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yeah when you are new its all about getting a cheap poker education, reading books isn't enough as you have to build experiance.
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Poker is all about the long long long long long long long term . . .
Barney's back . . . back again . . .
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ttanaka
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Administrator
Administrator
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 1,184
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This is good advice. Reading and studying is good, but experience is critical. Get the experience for as cheap as possible. Use some of your time to review your hand histories, study your own play to see how and where you are making mistakes, and incorporate your learnings in your next session.
Start off slow, play and then study your play, and then play more, and study more. Patience and discipline, you'll know when you'll be ready to move up in the stakes. Then you can start making money.
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Molinero
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Straight
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: In The General Vicinity of Dallas
Posts: 230
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thanks for the tips...I'm going to show my ignorance now: what on earth does SNG stand for?
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LeFou
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07-25-2004, 12:08 AM
Post subject: Poor Players making poor decisions
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#9 (permalink)
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Dallas, TX
Posts: 2,361
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are consistently taking my money. I mean consistently.
Incidentally, Molinero happens to be a friend of mine. Like him, I know how to bet big enough so that the pot odds don't justify a call for people with drawing hands. Like him, I am losing money consistently 'cause they call anyway. Consistently.
3 times today I had TPTK and bet the pot because two cards were suited. Three times I was called. Three times the flush made. A -$60 day so far...
So here's my thesis: I don't know about SNGs, but online ring games are about as beatable as the Texas State Lottery.
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michael1123
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Rochester Hills, MI
Posts: 1,720
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Haha, Sit and Gos. Otherwise called Single Table Touraments.
I'd stick to the cheaper variety of those, as well as microlimit tables for the time being.
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johnnyawe
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07-25-2004, 03:26 AM
Post subject: Re: Poor Players making poor decisions
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#11 (permalink)
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Full House
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: San Francisco
Posts: 1,064
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by LeFou
Incidentally, Molinero happens to be a friend of mine. Like him, I know how to bet big enough so that the pot odds don't justify a call for people with drawing hands. Like him, I am losing money consistently 'cause they call anyway. Consistently.
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Yeah, I've been there man. I'm by no means an experienced pro who is qualified to give advice, but I've been where you are now. When I was first getting started it was really hard, because I didn't know whether a downswing was really just a downswing, or if it was a problem with my game.
You just gotta figure that if you are supposed to win 65 out of 100 times when you have TPTK against a flush draw, its still entirely possible to lose 10 times in a row. It doesn't feel good while its happening, but it makes sense. If that kind of a downswing is enough to wipe you out, then you gotta drop down to lower stakes.
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michael1123
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07-25-2004, 03:41 AM
Post subject: Re: Poor Players making poor decisions
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#12 (permalink)
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Rochester Hills, MI
Posts: 1,720
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by LeFou
Like him, I know how to bet big enough so that the pot odds don't justify a call for people with drawing hands. Like him, I am losing money consistently 'cause they call anyway. Consistently.
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The thing is, dude, you want them to call against odds. That's how you make money in the long run.
If they're calling all the time, then raise the amount that you're betting. You want to bet as much as you can but still get some chasers calling you, when you have a great hand. Just be weary, if you think they're on a flush draw and that draw hits.
If they're calling way against odds, and you're able to lay down a decent hand that almost positively got out drawn when they bet big, you'll make money from the chasing in the long run for sure.
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Fnord
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Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: I'll Do You Like A Truck
Posts: 19,333
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My bankroll has been pretty much at a stand-still for the last month or so. Some of it has been playing with different formats, but there is a pretty big luck element to poker. Skilled poker play is like flipping a coin, heads you win $60, tails you lose $50.
Some advise:
o Table selection! Read my article on the subject. Finding good games and leaving bad games no matter how much money you've made/lost is probably the most under-rated skill in poker.
o Check your pre-flop selection. At 8-10 player NL ring table as a new player your play list should look something like this:
AA-22
AK AQ
AJs, ATs, KQs, KJs, KTs, QJs, QTs, JTs
..and still folding most of those to raises. I'm dead serious.
o Keep working on your call/raise/fold decisions. These are the hardest part and is where I spend a lot of time reviewing hands.
o Learn when to be aggressive and when not to. This is also key, as against some players bluffing or even semi-bluffing is a waste of chips. Until you learn better, it's hard to lose your ass being a little weak/tight and you'll do well playing like that against horrible players.
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