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azureXsmurF
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04-14-2006, 07:42 AM
Post subject: BR for STTs
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#1 (permalink)
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Straight
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Delaware, USA
Posts: 170
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Okay... so I've gotten over the former BR issues I had about a week and a half ago, and playing 1 table $5.50s on Stars I've built my roll back up from about $35 at the very worst all the way back up to $120... therefore I'm thinking SnGs are my forte and I'm going to stick to them for awhile. I'm not planning on moving up anytime soon obviously, but I was wondering when most of you would say it's okay to move up to the $11s. Right now my goal is a bit conservative, I'm thinking maybe $300 will let me get used to them comfortably, but is there a point before that where you guys think it would be a good idea to start mixing them in?
I'm doing pretty well result wise in the $5.50s... I haven't played enough to have an accurate sample size, but after 100 or so in the past few days I'm turning up about a 15-20% ROI (I've played around 100 sngs, total profit has been about $90... but it's estimations because I don't have PokerTracker and haven't been keeping specific stats). Should I shoot for about a certain approximate ROI before I move up, or is where I'm at pretty good?
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Staresy
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Full House
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Following the Herd to 6-Max Land
Posts: 1,240
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have a look at DogOnMySide's BR calculator by clicking here
the discussion thread is here
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donkbee
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WELP
Join Date: May 2005
Location: so close but so far
Posts: 3,604
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$300 is probably okay for the $11s if you're playing one table SnGs. Personally, I'm still playing mostly $11s with around 70 buyins, (with the occassional $22 slipped in) mostly because I am playing two table SnGs and I am trying to learn to multitable. I am very very conservative with my roll though. Do what you're comfortable with, and move down if your roll dips below an acceptable level.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fnord
Why poker fucks with our heads: it's the master that beats you for bringing in the paper, then gives you a milkbone for peeing on the carpet.
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biondino
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Putney, UK; Full Tilt,Mansion; $50 NL and PL; $13 and $16 SNGs at Stars
Posts: 3,170
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Heh - I play the $11s with a 200 buyin BR, but I am teh gay 
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andy-akb
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Maine
Posts: 1,836
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by biondino
Heh - I play the $11s with a 200 buyin BR, but I am teh gay |
What was your initial deposit? I could see having 100+ buyins at a level if you were pro and this was your job, but at the 11s I feel like its hurting your growth by being so overolled.
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donkbee
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WELP
Join Date: May 2005
Location: so close but so far
Posts: 3,604
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by biondino
Heh - I play the $11s with a 200 buyin BR, but I am teh gay |
You are definitely my new hero.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fnord
Why poker fucks with our heads: it's the master that beats you for bringing in the paper, then gives you a milkbone for peeing on the carpet.
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biondino
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Putney, UK; Full Tilt,Mansion; $50 NL and PL; $13 and $16 SNGs at Stars
Posts: 3,170
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Well, that's my whole BR, which I've built up over the last 11 months from $50, and have in lots of different sites. I play the $11s at Party, but I only have $170 or so in my Party account.
If I was convinced I was destroying the $11s (my ROI is pretty high but that's only after 75 or so), I'd move to the $22s permanently. At the moment, I play a $22 every time I win a $11. I haven't won one in a while 
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donkbee
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WELP
Join Date: May 2005
Location: so close but so far
Posts: 3,604
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Heh I went a while without winning ANYTHING recently I had so many 2nds, I could NOT win anything HU to save my life. Even when I played a few $22s, I could only come in second, lol. I broke that bad streak the other night though, hopefully now I have a streak of 1sts 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fnord
Why poker fucks with our heads: it's the master that beats you for bringing in the paper, then gives you a milkbone for peeing on the carpet.
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bantam222
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Straight
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 208
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hell i take a 2nd any day
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jyms
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Tilting Mod
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 4,836
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Quote:
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Well, that's my whole BR, which I've built up over the last 11 months from $50, and have in lots of different sites. I play the $11s at Party, but I only have $170 or so in my Party account
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That's an interesting way to look at it. I have two BR's (one on stars and one on Party) I never thought of it as one. I may be over-rolled and maybe I should be moving up from 5nl. Whats the position supposed to be on BR's on different sites. Do I only follow the BR management as if it were one, or do I treat each roLl separately??
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JeffreyGB
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Jenks, OK
Posts: 3,477
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To answer the original question, yes, $300 seems reasonable. The general guideline is to make sure you have at least 20 buyins (at the minimum) before moving up. Going a bit beyond that is (IMO) recommended.
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biondino
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Putney, UK; Full Tilt,Mansion; $50 NL and PL; $13 and $16 SNGs at Stars
Posts: 3,170
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A bankroll is all the cash you are prepared to lose at poker. It doesn't matter where it is, whether it's in different sites or even in your bank account. That's why I have no problem at all considering my $2200 BR as one entity despite the fact that it's currently sitting in at least 7 different poker sites.
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jyms
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Tilting Mod
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 4,836
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Well then i'm movin' on up. I've been a little leary about doing that because I only have $110 dollars on party and I was 4 tableing. I didn't want to remove the $45 dollars on stars because of the cheap tournies and S&G's. I won't pay the rake on the ones at party. I often play 4 tables of ring at party because they are easier and 10 player, as well as a S&G or MTT at stars at the same time. That also helps me keep track of which game is on the screen when it pops up. I figure with $145 dollars I can move up to 10NL on two if not all four ring games.
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biondino
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Putney, UK; Full Tilt,Mansion; $50 NL and PL; $13 and $16 SNGs at Stars
Posts: 3,170
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Being able to tile the 4 Party tables is a real boon. Sounds like you're sorted, Trainer.
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jyms
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Tilting Mod
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 4,836
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Sorted??
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biondino
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Putney, UK; Full Tilt,Mansion; $50 NL and PL; $13 and $16 SNGs at Stars
Posts: 3,170
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You are on a path to success/ know what you're doing/everything stacked up nicely. I didn't realise it was such a British thing to say
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jyms
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Tilting Mod
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 4,836
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yea, sorry just a good ole' canadian boy here. Maybe it's not so british as much as not a term I have heard before. Sorry about the highjack. Now back to the post.
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andy-akb
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Maine
Posts: 1,836
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Trainer_jyms
I figure with $145 dollars I can move up to 10NL on two if not all four ring games.
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$145 is still not 20 buyins recommended for cash games if you are playing at $10nl. If you are a proven winner then I think it wouldnt be horrible, but Id still advise against it. Grind it out at $5nl until your br gets to $200, then move up, if you dont want to do that then move up now, but dont play 4 tables at once, 2 table $10nl [if you also play 2 tables of $5nl you are still risking a good portion of your br at a time so i wouldnt do that] until you get atleast buyins, then add another table
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jyms
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Tilting Mod
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 4,836
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Yea, I was thinking that. Just 2 tables plus my usual MTT or S&G. Sorry that should also be $155 dollars ($110+&45) which is where I dont mind being at 10x buy-in for 1 table,15x buy-in for 2 tables and a tourney. I'm at low enough stakes that losing a deposit because of a bad week or two won't kill me, so playing at that BR management #'s isn't too scary. But if I lose a buy-in or two I might rethink it. Probably shouldn't have cashed the first $250 at stars but what the hell.
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biondino
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Putney, UK; Full Tilt,Mansion; $50 NL and PL; $13 and $16 SNGs at Stars
Posts: 3,170
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When I started playing NL ring (a year ago), the universally recommended min BR was 15 buyins. What changed? I would say a decent player at $10NL can easily get away with 15, personally, though I would never advise against caution.
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JeffreyGB
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Jenks, OK
Posts: 3,477
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15 buyins is the recommendation for ring. The original question specifically asked about STTs (single table tournaments; aka SNGs). The recommendation for those is a minimum of 20 buyins.
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Muxy
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Canadian LOLUH'S AND AMERICAN LOLUHS
Posts: 1,529
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http://www.pocketfives.com/5C57520F-...240CB3E59.aspx
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JeffreyGB
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Jenks, OK
Posts: 3,477
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Muxy
http://www.pocketfives.com/5C57520F-8A89-43F3-97E6-54D240CB3E59.aspx
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Good article. That's what I base my requirements on too. For beginner's (micro stakes), I'd think the unprotected amount should be sufficient.
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