|
Robb
|
10-23-2008, 05:31 PM
Post subject: Bad cbet? 10nl, TT on 9xx FD board
|
#1 (permalink)
|
|
4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 3,072
|
|
Villain is 28/10/0.9 over 100 hands. With this villain and this board, I think the flop cbet is bad, amiright?
$0.05/$0.1 No Limit Holdem
6 players
Converted at weaktight.com
Stacks:
Hero ($14.81)
UTG 1 ($2.43)
CO ($1.69)
BTN ($7.63)
SB ($10.27)
BB ($11.52)
Pre-flop: ($0.15, 6 players) Hero is UTG  
Hero raises to $0.35, UTG 1 calls $0.35, 3 folds, BB calls $0.25
Flop:    ($1.10, 3 players)
BB checks, Hero bets $1.10, UTG 1 folds, BB calls $1.10
Turn:  ($3.30, 2 players)
BB checks, Hero checks
River:  ($3.30, 2 players)
BB checks, Hero checks
[Results Hidden]
|
|
|
Play for FREE and practice your game at...
Join the FTR Poker Forum to disable these banners and start posting!
|
|
spoonitnow
|
|
Straight Flush
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: IRC Chat Room
Posts: 5,406
|
|
I deleted my initial reply to this because I'd probably get banned.
With that in mind, c-betting the flop is fine.
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Ripptyde
I only have 2 simple rules when I am coaching a new student.
Rule # 1: don't ask questions
Rule # 2: don't ask questions
I have no interest in discussing strategy with a protege'. Your job is to remain quiet and listen. I have a very systematic approach that I will share with the right candidate and I promise that I will turn you into a force of nature and show you elements of the game of poker that you never knew existed.
|
|
|
Muzzard
|
|
4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Cheshire, UK
Posts: 1,843
|
|
Give me one or more good reasons why bettig this flop is neither good or standard.
|
|
|
|
Robb
|
|
4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 3,072
|
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Muzzard
Give me one or more good reasons why bettig this flop is neither good or standard.
|
He's such a station on a semi-drawy board that it seems a cbet just helps him fold about half his range of hands - all ones that are beaten. You get no information from cbetting, and help him play more correctly.
That was my thinking, but maybe I should just standard cbet this muzz? His range is wide enough that this is value town, even though all the relevant draws are in his range? Dunno, that's why I posted it. I'm trying to get a handle on board texture where it's inadvisable to cbet overpairs.
|
|
|
|
Muzzard
|
|
4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Cheshire, UK
Posts: 1,843
|
|
We bet because
a) We want to price draws
b) We want to bet to protect
c) Get value from hands we beat
We have an over pair on a FD board, the fact you didnt cbet or bet the turn or river means u missed a whole lot of value. I'd like to add that Ts is probably good on the river.
|
|
|
|
Robb
|
|
4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 3,072
|
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Muzzard
We bet because
a) We want to price draws
b) We want to bet to protect
c) Get value from hands we beat
We have an over pair on a FD board, the fact you didnt cbet or bet the turn or river means u missed a whole lot of value. I'd like to add that Ts is probably good on the river.
|
What kind of 9xx board would you NOT value bet with TT? Or what kind of villain? Or is this auto-value for you?
|
|
|
|
deacon_bluez
|
|
Straight
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Minnesota, USA
Posts: 216
|
|
I think he'll call with lots of hands that you beat. I don't like the PSB though; more like 2/3 is what I would do on this board.
I usually cbet unless the board is very drawy. If you don't, it gets harder to cbet other times when you miss the flop.
|
|
Sue me if I play too long....
|
|
Muzzard
|
|
4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Cheshire, UK
Posts: 1,843
|
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Robb
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Muzzard
We bet because
a) We want to price draws
b) We want to bet to protect
c) Get value from hands we beat
We have an over pair on a FD board, the fact you didnt cbet or bet the turn or river means u missed a whole lot of value. I'd like to add that Ts is probably good on the river.
|
What kind of 9xx board would you NOT value bet with TT? Or what kind of villain? Or is this auto-value for you? |
This is auto value, if I get c/r or he calls and leads turn. Then I'll have to engage brain more.
Why are you not cbeting, trying to trap or something. I just totally don't get it.
|
|
|
|
d0zer
|
|
Moderator
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 2,518
|
|
Overpair + loose villain + drawy board = value  
I also 1/3 pot the river.
|
|
|
|
Robb
|
|
4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 3,072
|
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Muzzard
Why are you not cbeting, trying to trap or something. I just totally don't get it.
|
I'm working on a huge leak of playing too agro early and trapping myself. So I'm trying to learn restraint/pot control etc.
But I've plugged most of my horrible spewtard lines, and was moving down the list toward less total donkness. I was just wondering about playing med pp's that end up as overpairs on small, drawy boards. If it's auto-cbet, cool. We'll all return to normal and go overthink something else.
:P
|
|
|
|
bikes
|
|
a hot damn mess
Administrator
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 2,448
|
|
... I agree with Muzzard and Spoon.
|
|
I damage threads that may actually benefit some posters
|
|
Robb
|
|
4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 3,072
|
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by spoonitnow
I deleted my initial reply to this because I'd probably get banned.
With that in mind, c-betting the flop is fine.
|
I'd like to know what it was. I freakin' missed it.
Damn.
|
|
|
|
bikes
|
|
a hot damn mess
Administrator
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 2,448
|
|
BTW there is nothing to trap if you
Cbet the flop
B/F the turn
Check behind the river.
|
|
I damage threads that may actually benefit some posters
|
|
Stacks
|
|
4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Im opedipus bitch, the original balla.
Posts: 2,605
|
|
The fact that he is a calling station only adds to the fact that you should be c-betting this flop. Sure he will be calling with the majority of his draws, but he will also be calling with weaker pairs, whiffed overs, etc. You are ahead here a good majority of the time, therefore bet for the reasons muzzard stated. Not only do you make him pay for the draw, you get value from his worse hands, while "protecting" your hand.
Fwiw, I'm c-betting nearly all of my made hands and strong draws against this type of a villain. I'm probably checking behind and taking a free card with my whiffed overs, and weak draws (because he will still pay you when you hit your weak draw on later streets).
|
|
|
|
Robb
|
|
4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 3,072
|
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by XxStacksxX
The fact that he is a calling station only adds to the fact that you should be c-betting this flop. Sure he will be calling with the majority of his draws, but he will also be calling with weaker pairs, whiffed overs, etc. You are ahead here a good majority of the time, therefore bet for the reasons muzzard stated. Not only do you make him pay for the draw, you get value from his worse hands, while "protecting" your hand.
Fwiw, I'm c-betting nearly all of my made hands and strong draws against this type of a villain. I'm probably checking behind and taking a free card with my whiffed overs, and weak draws (because he will still pay you when you hit your weak draw on later streets).
|
thx
|
|
|
|
bigspenda73
|
|
Straight Flush
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Pwnsylvania
Posts: 7,545
|
|
river looks like ez thin value as well
|
|
|
|
Biglines
|
|
3-of-a-Kind
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 108
|
|
Is there anything wrong with betting each street here?
|
|
|
English
Deutsch
Español
Français
Italiano
Nederlands
Pусский
Svenska
05-26-2012, 03:08 PM Australia Legalized Online Poker coming up in next 6 to 12 Months
Linear Mode
