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davedavedave
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02-28-2005, 07:46 PM
Post subject: Attention Deficit Disorder and Poker?
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#1 (permalink)
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Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 2
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I have ADHD. I find out a lot of the "flaws" in this.... ?disease? seriously hinders my poker progress. I find the most significant problem is laying down. I KNOW KNOW KNOW when someone's hand beats me. Like 200%, yet i don't lay down.
Or i get impatient and impulsive during a long run. Or i don't know when to stop.
Anyone else dealing with this? or have any tips on how to deal?
thanks,
-dave
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Fnord
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Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: I'll Do You Like A Truck
Posts: 19,333
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I have ADD too.
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r8ed
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 1,524
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Make a bunch of charts with odds on them and put them around your computer (if you are playing online). When the decision comes, base it on the odds and not your impulses. This will reinforce your "hunch" that you are beat.
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ilikeaces86
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 2,141
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just go all in
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r8ed
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 1,524
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Or do what aces says.
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ilikeaces86
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 2,141
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when you have the nuts that is...
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mcpeepants
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Straight
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Raleigh, NC
Posts: 225
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davedavedave,
although I don't have ADHD, I do have this problem quite a bit. It is the biggest leak in my game (I think/hope). Calling when I KNOW I'm beat! It's extremely tough to slow down sometimes and just think about it instead of hitting the call button. I don't know if there is any real solution other than discipline. I have post it notes right by my computer, but when i'm under the gun I don't ever look at them. I've told myself I won't move up in limits until I go 2 weeks without doing something stupid like that. I think hopefully with experience the problem with correct itself.
One thing I've noticed is that if I'm on a winning streak I'm more prone to do this. It's sort of the anti-tilt, but it loses me more money than tilt. When i'm on tilt i KNOW to stop playing. When I'm on anti-tilt I'm on top of the world and will often make bad decisions because If I lose money I don't really care (at the moment).
So, I don't know if there is a real solution to it other than true self improvement, which is tough. Keep me informed if you come up with a better solution though.
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ttanaka
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Administrator
Administrator
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 1,184
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davedavedave,
Perhaps playing more tables at a time? Maybe you need the stimulation of action on other tables, and won't care about pursuing a losing hand on one table.
Maybe 4 simultaneous tables will actually help you improve your game. It should help with the patience issues you may be having.
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lolzzz_321
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NO YOU
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: My ice is polarized
Posts: 2,797
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Don't play poker?
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mike4066
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 1,943
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I also have ADD, I find its fairly simple to deal wit... Hey lets go play poker, no wait lets paint the barn.. no lets, oh shit what were we doing?
hehe..
Seriously, I do show many signs of ADD, i've talked to a few doctors, taken a few meds no changes to I just figured after 27 years I've just learned to live with it.
I believe it does get to me a bit at the tables, it would help explain some of my inconsitancies in my play. But I believe its something that can be worked through. I find if i'm able to completly engross myself in something I'm "ok".
I have to remove the distractions from around me even more so than most people would. I find that if there are people in the same room talking, or something really noisy going on in the next room it gets to me. I can't focus thats part of the reason if you ever see me playing poker at home I'm wearing headphones alone in the room.
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ensign_lee
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: The University of TEXAS at Austin
Posts: 2,237
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Now, take this with a grain of salt, but I'd say play more tables.
I'd like to think that I can handle multiple stimuli all at once, and I have a pretty hard time of keeping track of 3 tables.
Perhaps the other table can be your distractions? I think you'd be pretty good at multitabling if you had ADHD or ADD, but I don't actually have it, so this is idle speculation. :P
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lovemachine
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Straight
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 190
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i saw one of the WPT a few weeks ago, and one of the players who was at the final table actually had ADHD and they were talking to him about it and one of the reasons he enjoys poker is because it helps him control his ADHD. now this may sound weird at first but the reason he was able to control his ADHD by playing poker was because he would do all he could to get mentally involved in the hand and focus on every detail that happened during the hand. now this may be easier to do in real life because of your surroundings and you can focus your attention to the other players and trying to find reads, etc. but for online just try to remember everything that has happened in the hand. who raised, how much, what kind of draws are out, what kind of hands people would be calling with, etc. just keep asking yourself questions the whole time such as what do you think that guy has, is he bluffing with overcards, did he hit his ace, etc. so next time you play just try focusing as much as possible on every detail and keep yourself thinking the whole time. i also suggest multi tables at once.
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wobbler
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Straight
Join Date: Sep 2004
Posts: 134
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I set a limit to how long I play. It's much easier to play my best game and endure the frustrations and temptations of poker if I know for how long I have to keep it up. If I just play and play without an end in sight I know I will start tilting eventually and every session will end on a bad note.
Also, I play multiple tables like ttanaka suggested.
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Crunch
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Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Saint John
Posts: 82
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Damn. I've got ADD as well. Interesting to see how many players (good ones, even) have it. It's funny that I have the same problem of laying down when I've gone agressive. I hate leaving chips in the pot. I gues...just dont do it. Or something.
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ilikeaces86
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 2,141
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Just make sure you have pocket rockets when you get agressive
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wobbler
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Straight
Join Date: Sep 2004
Posts: 134
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Everyone has problems laying down in poker, I don't think it has anything to do with ADD. The rules are rigged to encourage bad play. A good player is someone who can overcome his "natural" instinct to play badly, whether he has ADD or not.
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davedavedave
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Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 2
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thanks guys. All your tips, i will consider. Also encouraging to know i'm not "stranded on the island alone" if you will
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Repoman75
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Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 16
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You talked about how it's hard to lay down when you're almost certain you are beaten. You know what helps this? Practice. Continuous practice. Hours and hours of practice. I find myself now, after a lot of practice, calling hands that in the past I would have folded immediately too, and I'm WINNING. Call it instinct or whatever, but I can feel out who has the best hands. And the other play isn't always bluffing.. they just don't have the better cards. And vice versa... it has been easier to lay down AA or KK or even straights when you just "know" you're beat. It's really kinda cool feeling and experiencing the evolution of play. I'm not saying I win everyhand, or it's easy now, but practice and experience go along way... longer than reading books or following odds in my opinion.
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Radix
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Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 15
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This is a great topic, because I have been living with ADD all my life. I currently take no medication for it but I have been discussing a treatment plan with my doctor recently.
Everyone's ADD is a little different. For me the hardest part is keeping track of hands I see other people play and keeping track of the betting that is going on. Sometimes I realize that I've been watching t.v. for a full minute while unknowingly checking and folding. I have looked into my hand histories and found that I folded good hands without realizing it.
My first few deposits turned into nothing. Although I tried my best to play a tight aggressive game and took things like pot odds into account, I couldn't build a bankroll. One of my symptoms is getting easily frustrated and quitting so I gave up for a while. Then I decided that I should change the environment I play in.
No T.V.
No one else in the room
No drinking
No less than 300x BB
NO MULTITABLING
I disagree with those that say multitabling is good for ADD sufferers, even thought it may make them more comfortable. The discipline to focus on one game well enough to get reads on players and make good decisions can be learned with or without ADD. When you play more hands per hour, you can potentially make more mistakes per hour. I feel this applies most to less experienced players such as myself. As far as I am concerned, my ADD just doesn't allow me to play well on more than one table. If you are an advanced player and you have ADD and you mult-table, well then good on ya for overcoming your disorder.
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