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Was the ass-kicking my fault?

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sarbox68

08-21-2007, 01:49 AM Post subject: Was the ass-kicking my fault?

#1 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Sep 2006

Location: wondering where the 3 extra chairs at my 6max table came from

Posts: 871

UB NL $10... reads on all opps were vLag

Okay... so in the span of 180 hands, I dropped 3 buy-ins. I then quit, 'cause I was starting to get a little hot under the collar.

So in the spirit of "truth of the present condition," any honest assessments of what I did to contribute to my own ass kicking. Brutal and blunt is always accepted.....

Hand #1
Pot Limit Holdem Ring game
Blinds: $0.05./$0.10.
10 players
Converter

Pre-flop: (10 players) Hero is MP2 with Q

3 folds, MP1 raises to $0.2, Hero raises to $0.8, MP3 calls, 4 folds, MP1 calls.

Flop: 5

($2.55, 3 players)
MP1 checks, Hero bets $1.5, MP3 raises to $3, MP1 folds, Hero raises all-in $8.31, MP3 calls.
I'm pushing over his raise with a strong over-pair. I want him out before an A or K hits.

Turn: 2

($19.17, 1 player + 1 all-in - Main pot: $19.17)

River: 3

($19.17, 1 player + 1 all-in - Main pot: $19.17)

Results:
Final pot: $19.17

Hand #2
Uch....

No Limit Holdem Ring game
Blinds: $0.05./$0.10.
10 players
Converter

Pre-flop: (10 players) Hero is Button with Q

UTG calls, UTG+1 folds, UTG+2 calls, 2 folds, MP3 calls, CO calls, Hero raises to $0.7, 2 folds, UTG calls, 2 folds, CO calls.

Flop: J

($2.45, 3 players)
UTG checks, CO bets $0.65, Hero raises to $1.8, UTG calls, CO folds.

Turn: 2

($6.7, 2 players)
UTG bets $6.7, Hero calls.
Should I have assumed trips or a set here? This guy was a bit of a maniac so I took this for anything from Ax to any pocket pair in addition to trips and set. I wasn't sure how much to read into the fact that he called my decent size flop bet with my read.

River: K

($20.1, 2 players)
UTG bets $0.1, Hero calls.

Results:
Final pot: $20.3

Hand #3
I felt like I got my money in with the best of it against a short stack (and I actually was ahead pre-flop) so this one is more of a shit happens than a help me....

Pot Limit Holdem Ring game
Blinds: $0.05./$0.10.
8 players
Converter

Pre-flop: (8 players) Hero is MP2 with Q

3 folds, Hero raises to $0.4, CO folds, Button raises all-in $2.28, 2 folds, Hero calls.

Flop: Q

($4.71, 1 player + 1 all-in - Main pot: $4.71)

Turn: 9

($4.71, 1 player + 1 all-in - Main pot: $4.71)

River: T

($4.71, 1 player + 1 all-in - Main pot: $4.71)

Results:
Final pot: $4.71

Hand #4
I'm going to f'in kill somebody with this one...... after I stop pounding my head into my desk.

No Limit Holdem Ring game
Blinds: $0.05./$0.10.
10 players
Converter

Pre-flop: (10 players) Hero is CO with T

UTG folds, UTG+1 calls, UTG+2 calls, MP1 folds, MP2 calls, MP3 calls, Hero raises to $0.7, 3 folds, UTG+1 calls, 2 folds, MP3 calls.

Flop: 3

($2.45, 3 players)
UTG+1 bets $0.4, MP3 folds, Hero raises to $3.65, UTG+1 raises all-in $4.02, Hero calls.

Turn: 9

($10.49, 1 player + 1 all-in - Main pot: $10.49)

River: 5

($10.49, 1 player + 1 all-in - Main pot: $10.49)

Results:
Final pot: $10.49

>>sigh<< And this is when I quit playing for the night. Time to go watch Meerkat Manor on Tivo.........

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spoonitnow

08-21-2007, 02:03 AM

#2 (permalink)

Straight Flush

Join Date: Sep 2005

Location: IRC Chat Room

Posts: 5,406

Hand 1: At 10nl this is AT/KT a lot, so I'm okay with getting it in on the flop.

Hand 2: Bleh. The flop raise is okay at 10nl to see where you're at imo, but I think you've gotta fold on the turn.

Hand 3: At 10nl if you're closing the action this is a call all day unless you note the guy to be tight.

Hand 4: I might raise 1-2 bb more than normal preflop just because I don't like playing TT/JJ multiway. This is a spot where I might fold just because it seems like a set with the limp/call preflop combined with the weak lead/push on the flop.

Overall 10nl sucks imo because you can't really get a feel for where you're at on a hand-by-hand basis and just have to go with where you're at most of the time in given spots against typical 10nl players. Looks like you're playing fine to me, just taking an ass-kicking.

I pushed through 10nl a few months ago on a $200 loan and I know it's a bitch. Best of luck.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ripptyde

I only have 2 simple rules when I am coaching a new student.

Rule # 1: don't ask questions

Rule # 2: don't ask questions

I have no interest in discussing strategy with a protege'. Your job is to remain quiet and listen. I have a very systematic approach that I will share with the right candidate and I promise that I will turn you into a force of nature and show you elements of the game of poker that you never knew existed.

bode

08-21-2007, 02:05 AM

#3 (permalink)

Straight Flush

Join Date: May 2006

Location: slow motion

Posts: 4,270

bode is an unknown quantity at this point

hand 1 is pretty standard. and you dont want him out before the A or K hits, you want him in w/ hands like TPTK and FD's

hand 2: if hes a maniac its not horrible, but against a normal villain he has a J here almost always.

hand 3: standard.

hand 4: standard.

keep your head up, you played all of these hands fine, maybe w/ the exception of hand 2. I swing 3-5 buyins either way on a normal night, so you get used to this after a while. Besides, this is why we play w/ 20x buyin. Also, its good that you know when to quit when youre tilting, i still have problems w/ this sometimes.

Quote:

eeevees are not monies yet...they are like baby monies.

aokrongly

08-24-2007, 05:16 AM Post subject: ...

#4 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Jan 2005

Posts: 863

...

martindcx1e

08-24-2007, 07:31 AM

#5 (permalink)

4-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Mar 2005

Posts: 3,614

if you always pay off better hands when you have an overpair then you're not really winning any money when you stack other ppls' overpairs.

Wikipedia is the best thing ever. Anyone in the world can write anything they want about any subject. So you know you are getting the best possible information.

Ash256

08-24-2007, 01:16 PM

#6 (permalink)

4-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Mar 2006

Location: UK

Posts: 1,760

I think hand 2 is your big problem here because IMO it's a clear fold. This guy has limped UTG (Sign 1 that he's an idiot with a wide range) and check-called the flop. Think about the range of hands he'd do this with. I'd put it at J7-JK, T8, QT, and a few medium pocket pairs. I wouldn't say Ax is in his range (even though he's a maniac) because a maniac plays too aggressively and checking then coldcalling a bet and a raise is not an aggressive play, therefore he's probably slowplaying.
He then bets the pot on the turn. He obviously wants to get good money in this pot. Now I think we can narrow his range down to a Jack and 99 (unless he's extremely bluffy which is really doubtful).. Which makes this a fold.

Listen to my music

sarbox68

08-24-2007, 02:18 PM

#7 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Sep 2006

Location: wondering where the 3 extra chairs at my 6max table came from

Posts: 871

Thanks a ton for the great input! I went through PT after reading all this, and interesting note:
1) QQ is my #1 losing hand by $. AA, JJ & TT are in my top 10 of biggest losing hands by $. And the big losses are stacking against someone that then draws out to something better. With JJ & TT it's also because I R PF and then back off when an overcard hits on the F and end up folding...
2) AQo & AJs are also in this list. Mostly from hitting an overpair that I either R/C-B/F into oblivion or hang on to and lose at SD.
3) Most of the times when I win w/ AA, JJ, TT, it's a small pot - blinds only or maybe a single PF call that folds on the flop.

Moral of this sad tale... I obviously have no idea how to play big pockets and overpairs. And I thought these were supposed to be the easy hands to play...

a definite carryover from my limit playing I think.... Instead to AOK's point, I'm winning small (with the exception of KK for some reason, which is my #1 winning hand... go figure) and losing big.

I guess I need to really dial-back my big-pockets & TPTK. They don't play well to showdown but more importantly, I'm losing big with them. If I get past the flop, and people are still in, I've got to be willing to assume the worst and dump them (minus any additional draws on my part) to aggression.

One other related question... Most of the flops I see when I'm holding these seem to have 2 suited opening the possibility for a FD. I've been firing a pot-sized bet every time I see this to eliminate the drawing odds. 1) this makes my PP/OPs even more expensive, 2) builds the pot bigger when the 4-flush opp hits and 3) doesn't appear to push anyone off of their FD at $10NL. Should I dial-back this practice as well? Maybe just stick to 1/2pot bets even in the presence of an FD and hope to play it out to see a miss?

Again, thanks for the great feedback!!!

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Was the ass-kicking my fault?

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