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AQs Multiway Reraised Pot

  
 
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!Luck
Old 03-11-2009, 05:00 AM     Post subject: AQs Multiway Reraised Pot #1 (permalink)  
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 No reads.

Questions:

PF: Raise too big or too small?
Flop: Is it stupid to try to see the next card cheap, since I am calling almost anything here.
Turn: I have the odds even if i know he has a set right?

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.02 BB (8 handed) - Poker-Stars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com

Button ($1)
SB ($3.43)
BB ($3.62)
UTG ($4.45)
UTG+1 ($3)
Hero (MP1) ($2.01)
MP2 ($3.75)
CO ($9.85)

Preflop: Hero is MP1 with Q, A
UTG bets $0.08, UTG+1 calls $0.08, Hero raises to $0.22, 1 fold, CO calls $0.22, 3 folds, UTG calls $0.14, UTG+1 calls $0.14

Flop: ($0.91) 8, J, 6 (4 players)
UTG checks, UTG+1 bets $0.02, Hero calls $0.02, CO calls $0.02, UTG raises to $0.94, UTG+1 calls $0.92, Hero calls $0.92, CO calls $0.92

Turn: ($4.67) 4 (4 players)
UTG bets $3.29 (All-In), 1 fold, Hero calls $0.85 (All-In), 1 fold

River: ($6.37) 3 (2 players, 2 all-in)

Total pot: $6.37 | Rake: $0.30
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Kbryce23
Old 03-11-2009, 05:11 AM #2 (permalink)  
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If you are going to raise preflop i think you need to raise more especially since there is a raise and a caller, I would go like .30-.35. I dont think a flat call is that bad either, but I dont know if that is correct. I would try to get it all in after the flop.
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xpaand
Old 03-11-2009, 05:12 AM #3 (permalink)  
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 IMO, PF raise too big considering AQ can be dominated. I might have folded on that .92 raise, although I probably would've called it.

The odds of beating him if he has JJ is 5.25 to 1. The pot odds were 5.5 to 1 so yeah, you did have the odds. (I'm pretty sure I did those calculations correctly, but could someone double check)?
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If I bet as a bluff, I should be thinking "am I getting better hands to fold? Is it likely that he will fold x% of the time to a y sized bet to make it +EV?". If I bet for value, I should be thinking "am I getting worst hands to call? Am I ahead of enough of his range that this is a good value bet?".
 
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Kbryce23
Old 03-11-2009, 05:15 AM #4 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xpaand
IMO, PF raise too big considering AQ can be dominated. I might have folded on that .92 raise, although I probably would've called it.

The odds of beating him if he has JJ is 5.25 to 1. The pot odds were 5.5 to 1 so yeah, you did have the odds. (I'm pretty sure I did those calculations correctly, but could someone double check)?
Preflop raise is too big? Should he minraise to .16?
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xpaand
Old 03-11-2009, 05:27 AM #5 (permalink)  
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 Oh yeah, you're right. Nevermind
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If I bet as a bluff, I should be thinking "am I getting better hands to fold? Is it likely that he will fold x% of the time to a y sized bet to make it +EV?". If I bet for value, I should be thinking "am I getting worst hands to call? Am I ahead of enough of his range that this is a good value bet?".
 
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!Luck
Old 03-11-2009, 11:14 PM #6 (permalink)  
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 I think by 3-betting here I take control of the pot, which generally is a .good thing
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Old 03-12-2009, 03:46 AM #7 (permalink)  
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flat pre because you're never ahead of the UTG raiser's range
then shove the flop, it kind of sucks that people folded on the turn for such a small bet

when you have four people on the flop, shove over UTG raise and hope all 4 call because the result of people folding the turn makes me sad since they'd definitely put that money in bad on the flop

although you might fold out the CO which would be terrible, but the problem with not shoving is that the UTG player might drive him out since they're both deeper so you'll get screwed since yes he'd call your 90 cent bet on the turn, but he's facing a $3 bet

maybe people disagree with me here, but I think shoving the flop is better as played and flatting pre is even better
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Ragnar4
Old 03-12-2009, 04:00 AM #8 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by "iopq"[b
]flat pre because you're never ahead of the UTG raiser's range[/b]
then shove the flop, it kind of sucks that people folded on the turn for such a small bet
I dunno; AQ is a hand you want HU, Flatting pre hu is fine IMO, but I think that you need to get it to HU, True, you are crushed by AA, in a lot of trouble vs KK and AK, and AQ, but you're flipping versus every other PP out there plus some wierd hands that people may be wiling to raise with if they aren't very good.

If he re-raises after your sizeable 3-bet then you can get away. But seeing this pot multiway is a mistake in most cases IMO.

Hero's preflop re-raise was really thin too. I think it was too thin considering that villain only needed to get 2.20 from the pot to set hunt. .24 or .25 is the sweetspot here IMO.

If there wasn't a caller between UTG and Hero then .22 is about perfect.
The older I get, the more I start wondering; Just what in the hell is going on here?
 
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bigspenda73
Old 03-12-2009, 04:40 AM #9 (permalink)  
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 def. flat pre

stop 3betting UTG openers in tight FR games please
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!Luck
Old 03-12-2009, 04:47 AM #10 (permalink)  
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 Thanks. I just hate cold calling pre flop. Seems the advice i have been getting here and on my other hands is that with a nut flush draw + overs i am safe to push on flop.

-!luck
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