Poker Forum

Over 1,246,000 Posts!

REGISTER
Subscribe to FTR web feed
Already Registered?      Username:    Password:   Remember      Forgot Password

Poker Forum

  > 

Beginners Circle

  > 

AQs call or 3-bet?

  
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Nakamura
Old 06-03-2009, 10:01 PM     Post subject: AQs call or 3-bet? #1 (permalink)  
Nakamura's Avatar
4-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Grindin'
Posts: 1,515
Nakamura is an unknown quantity at this point
 This is probably super basic ... but should we just call here? AQs seems like a hand that is going to play well 2 or 3 handed.

Raiser seems a bit tight (6/6/3.0 over 49), the player in the BB is a bit of a nut job running at 55/3/1.5 over 40 hands or so.

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.10 BB (8 handed) - Poker-Stars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com

UTG ($10)
UTG+1 ($15.90)
MP1 ($1.55)
MP2 ($11.30)
CO ($10.15)
Button ($2.75)
Hero (SB) ($12.50)
BB ($6)

Preflop: Hero is SB with Q, A
3 folds, MP2 bets $0.30, 2 folds, Hero ??
Reply With Quote

Play for FREE and practice your game at...

Join the FTR Poker Forum to disable these banners and start posting!
kmind
Old 06-04-2009, 12:17 AM #2 (permalink)  
kmind's Avatar
Straight Flush

Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Not Giving In
Posts: 4,240
kmind is on a distinguished road
 Merits to calling? Merits to 3betting? Merits to folding?
Reply With Quote
Hoopy
Old 06-04-2009, 01:14 AM #3 (permalink)  
Hoopy's Avatar
Full House

Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Riverballs
Posts: 776
Hoopy is an unknown quantity at this point
 Since this guy is open raising 6% of his hands his range is roughly 88+,ATs+,KQs,AQo+. Against this range we are 43%.

3 betting won't be any good for value, as if he's a nit he'll dump most of his range that we are ahead of. Don't really know if we have much fold equity here, I'm still trying to learn about that.

Folding just seems too weak, calling and letting the fish in the BB come in seems best, if we flop big we'll likely get some value out of him.
 
Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2009, 04:20 AM #4 (permalink)  
Guest

Posts: n/a
call and stack the fish imo
Reply With Quote
linaker
Old 06-04-2009, 01:17 PM #5 (permalink)  
3-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: UK
Posts: 70
linaker
Call. Looks like a bad spot for a re-raise.
Reply With Quote
Lucothefish
Old 06-04-2009, 01:34 PM #6 (permalink)  
Lucothefish's Avatar
Full House

Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Cretaceous Park
Posts: 700
Lucothefish will become famous soon enough
 Nakamura, what made you consider 3betting here?
<@d0zer> how will you learn if I don't berate you harshly?
 
Reply With Quote
oskar
Old 06-04-2009, 02:03 PM #7 (permalink)  
oskar's Avatar
4-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: in ur accounts... confiscating ur funz
Posts: 2,452
oskar has a spectacular aura aboutoskar has a spectacular aura aboutoskar has a spectacular aura about
 Folding is worth a consideration.

These stats are pretty useless in absence of steal%. If he does steal then his MP2 opening range should be tighter than you'd expect - even if not, he might be folding ATo, AJo and some PP's here with a 6% range.

It's pretty useless to think about what % we are against his range in all-in preflop scenarios. What you need to know is how good your hand plays oop against his range... let's assume 6% for the sake of argument (this could be wrong).
I'd say his range is: 88+, ATs+, KQs, AQo
If an A comes, you are dominated by AA(1) AK(8), 3x set for every flop card >8, you tie with AQ(6) and you dominate AJs(2), ATs(2) of his hands that will continue. He'll prolly just give up on his pp's(30)
So you don't get value out of your aces.

The only flop you really want to see is Q high, AQx, TJK, 2 hearts or some combination of those.
Then you need to know how aggressive he is post flop. Does he just check back if he misses, and can you steal the turn?
How often does he give up to donk bets?

I might still play the AQs, but there are better hands to play against his range - especially oop - being oop sucks 100 times more than you might realize right now. Just generally I don't want to tangle with these super nits too much when they decide to open a hand, unless I have a plan how I'm going to exploit them.



I kind of like the idea of 3-betting though, and it's an easy example... of course it's a bluff!
But how narrow does his 3-bet-calling / 4-betting range need to be to make it profitable?
U can start counting teh combinaishns now imo.
Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2009, 02:11 PM #8 (permalink)  
Guest

Posts: n/a
Quote:
Originally Posted by oskar
Folding is worth a consideration.
no, 6/6 over 49 is something I get when I'm running card dead

plus, he's raising to .3
we're calling .25 in a pot of .7 if the fish folds
we really need only 35% equity to make the call in a vacuum

even if we're OOP, we still have 43% against his range
if the fish enters the pot at least we'll have relative position since fish acts after the supposed nit cbets
Reply With Quote
oskar
Old 06-04-2009, 02:15 PM #9 (permalink)  
oskar's Avatar
4-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: in ur accounts... confiscating ur funz
Posts: 2,452
oskar has a spectacular aura aboutoskar has a spectacular aura aboutoskar has a spectacular aura about
 The 43% is completely irrelevant since you're not all-in.
You're in a lot of trouble if he gives you action, and he's probably just giving up on most flops that hit you when he's behind.

I don't hate a call, but folding is not terrible and it's worth a consideration. - more so than 3-betting.
Reply With Quote
Old 06-04-2009, 03:10 PM #10 (permalink)  
Guest

Posts: n/a
Quote:
Originally Posted by oskar
The 43% is completely irrelevant since you're not all-in.
You're in a lot of trouble if he gives you action, and he's probably just giving up on most flops that hit you when he's behind.

I don't hate a call, but folding is not terrible and it's worth a consideration. - more so than 3-betting.
but our hand is super-playable because it's suited
it's a clear call in my mind
if you fold AQs you're basically playing 3b or fold with everything but pps
Reply With Quote
Fnord
Old 06-06-2009, 07:28 AM #11 (permalink)  
Fnord's Avatar
Moderator

Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: I'll Do You Like A Truck
Posts: 19,333
Fnord is an unknown quantity at this point
Send a message via MSN to Fnord
CALL
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EBvge-c2_Xg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w-Xz8aLuD7Y
 
Reply With Quote
Azazel
Old 06-06-2009, 02:34 PM #12 (permalink)  

Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 48
Azazel
If we are on the button (not SB) should we still flat and try and get three way with the fish? Or is 3beting better here?
Reply With Quote
Old 06-06-2009, 02:53 PM #13 (permalink)  
Guest

Posts: n/a
Quote:
Originally Posted by Azazel
If we are on the button (not SB) should we still flat and try and get three way with the fish? Or is 3beting better here?
I still like calling
Reply With Quote
Robb
Old 06-06-2009, 11:24 PM #14 (permalink)  
4-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 3,068
Robb is an unknown quantity at this point
Quote:
Originally Posted by iopq
Quote:
Originally Posted by oskar
Folding is worth a consideration.
no, 6/6 over 49 is something I get when I'm running card dead

plus, he's raising to .3
we're calling .25 in a pot of .7 if the fish folds
we really need only 35% equity to make the call in a vacuum

even if we're OOP, we still have 43% against his range
if the fish enters the pot at least we'll have relative position since fish acts after the supposed nit cbets
The "equity needed" percentages (in bold above) are pretty worthless since we're oop and likely to be offering reverse implied odds about 40% of the time. We need more than just "price in" pot odds to make our decision here.

I do agree w/ IOPQ in that I'd be surprised if he's still PFR = 6% in another 250 hands.

Remember if you call and do hit your hand that most micro players cannot handle the ol' donk bet lead and start spewing when you use it on them. It's like the most straightforward way to play, but it crosses them up bigtime. Nice to use as a bluff w/ an underpair sometimes, too.
My Operation and FTR Rethread: Stations are *sob* so hard to play against
 
Reply With Quote
Reply
Latest Poker News
KoRnholio Old 05-26-2012, 03:08 PM    Australia Legalized Online Poker coming up in next 6 to 12 Months
According to an email sent out by Mark Bryan, a gaming analyst at Merrill Lynch, the Australian government plans to legalize online poker sometime in the next six to 12 months. This move will coincide ...

« Previous Thread | Next Thread »
Thread Tools
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts
BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


All times are GMT. The time now is 06:50 AM.

Contact Us - Archive - Top

FTR Testimonials

All content
© FlopTurnRiver.com 		Advertising  |   Partners  |   Testimonials  |   T&C  |   Contact Us  |   FTR News & Press  |   Site Map  |   Search FTR

Full Tilt  |   Titan Poker  |   UltimateBet  |   Poker Stars  |   Ladbrokes Bonus  |   Sportsbook  |   Cake Poker  

Play Texas Holdem Online, Online Texas Holdem Strategy, & Poker Forum
This is not a gambling website.