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FlyingSaucy
Old 10-15-2004, 02:51 PM     Post subject: Another scenario + advice question #1 (permalink)  
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Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Watching the kids
Posts: 1,603
FlyingSaucy
Here's a scenario. home game single table tourney, started with 8 players, now at 6.

chip counts:
Player 1: ~100
Player 2: ~400
Player 3: ~150
Player 4: ~250
Player 5: ~50
Me: ~100

Player 4 is dealer.
Player 5: post SB (2)
Me: post BB (4)

(deal)

Player 1: call (4)
Player 2: call (4)
Player 3: fold
Player 4: fold
Player 5: (SB) call (2)
Me: (BB) my hand = Qd 4d. Check

Flop: 9d Jd Th

Player 5: check
Me: I sit there and count the outs in my head - 3 outs to pair my Q, 6 for the straight (four K's and four 8's minus the Kd and 8d which are counted as the flush outs), 9 for the flush. So I arrive at 18. Do I semi bluff from this position? What kind of bet do I make? Do I just check it to hope the other two guys behind me will also? What other factors would you think about here?

Me: bet (16)
Player 1: after a long pause and lots of grimacing, fold
Player 2: raise (32)
Player 5: fold
Me: fold

I folded when it came back to me since player 2 either already had something decent or maybe a stronger flush draw, making me doubt that I actually had 18 outs - the actual number was probably much lower. I didn't get the impression that he was bluffing at pots earlier in the game. If he already had something I figured him for maybe trip 9's or two pair. What the hell should I have done? Was betting the pot after the flop way too aggressive for the hand that I had in that position? Calling his 32 bet would have only given me 1:2 pot odds, which sucks for a drawing hand. Maybe he knew I was on a draw and really only had a low pocket pair.
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Radashack
Old 10-15-2004, 04:59 PM #2 (permalink)  
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Flush

Join Date: Sep 2004
Posts: 522
Radashack
your raise of 4xBB was a good one, but I would have called even if your outs dropped a bit even down to 12 you still have the oportunity of about 50% to hit your hand. Now this is depending on the player of course. How good was he as a player... Weak players make big raises

I probably would have called that 90% of the time depending on the player
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Krapp
Old 10-15-2004, 06:34 PM #3 (permalink)  
Flush

Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 313
Krapp
Ok, your one of the short-stacks, limp the preflop, BB is 5% of your stack, and you catch a flush and straight draw.

As far as the blinds to your chipcount, your ok. You generally start have to get more aggressive when it becomes 10%. E.g if there was more money in the pot, you would consider pushing or doing a check/all-in. Overall you have a very good drawing hand. I would count 15 outs for the 9-flush and the 6-open straight. I am guessing your better than even money to win... The queen is not an out since someone with a K or 8 would beat you. I generally dont like betting drawing hands unless it can buy me a card and that normally could happen if you were betting last. Therefor I would prefer to check and see what everyone else does. The best scenario is a min bet happens, everyone calls-in, the pot builds, and you get a cheap card. Another scenario is someone bets big and you would need to decide to fold/call/raise. I wouldnt mind going all-in to an opp if they bet at least 10% of my stack. I have the possibly of them folding, picking-up 10% on my stack. or they call and I have better than 50% to double-up.

In your situation, I would either fold or go all-in. I would tend to go all-in since 20% of your chips are already-in and your better than even money to win the hand (compounded with the chance the opp could fold and you pick-up 40% to your chipstack). Opp is chipleader too so they might be just bullying you around... Also, I wouldnt put them on a flush draw.
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