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Am i wrong or is it just bad luck Not sure advice please

  
 
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bigstock2001
Old 09-22-2008, 05:02 PM     Post subject: Am i wrong or is it just bad luck Not sure advice please #1 (permalink)  
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Cake Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $0.10 BB (9 handed) - Cake-Poker Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com

MP3 ($5.90)
CO ($5.75)
Hero (Button) ($18.77)
SB ($5.15)
BB ($14.13)
UTG ($13.08)
UTG+1 ($17.74)
MP1 ($11.13)
MP2 ($10.45)

Preflop: Hero is Button with 4, A
UTG calls $0.10, 3 folds, MP3 calls $0.10, 1 fold, Hero calls $0.10, 1 fold, BB checks

Flop: ($0.45) 2, 5, 3 (4 players)
BB checks, UTG checks, MP3 bets $1.05, Hero raises to $2.10, 2 folds, MP3 raises to $5.80 (All-In), Hero calls $2.65

Turn: ($9.95) 5 (2 players, 1 all-in)

River: ($9.95) A (2 players, 1 all-in)

Total pot: $9.95
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Stacks
Old 09-22-2008, 05:06 PM #2 (permalink)  
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 You didn't play it that well, but you had to felt obviously. Fold preflop. Raise flop better, don't minraise.
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cardsman1992
Old 09-22-2008, 05:07 PM #3 (permalink)  
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raise or fold PF.

You are only behind 46 on the flop, what's not to like?
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Trashcona
Old 09-22-2008, 05:10 PM #4 (permalink)  
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 I like a fold preflop, but as played you need to raise more on the flop, obviously you want to get it all in here.
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bigstock2001
Old 09-22-2008, 05:19 PM #5 (permalink)  
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I agree on the min raise on the turn, however I am sure he would have called any raise I dont think there is any way i could have avoided him from going all in. I just feel there might have been a better way to control the pot. I honestly feel i was destined to loose this hand.

I have another hand where i flopped a small flop with my poket kings and I raised 3/4 pot and two people whent all in both on a flush draw and they hit there flush. i was trying to find the hand in my hh to post it.

if you are facing an all in call and you have a solid read that they are on a flush draw and you have a hand like kk knowing the outs should you just lay it down? I have a hard time doing that to a person on a draw, It just seems one of two things happens if i try and raise big enough to stop the draw the player goes all in. If bet to little they draw out. all of this happens at .05 .10
Don't get me wrong i am doing alot better online I have been winning more consistantly with some great advice, I just can't seem to take control of the pots to stop them from getting bloated and loosing big pots to draws.

Thanks
Don
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Stacks
Old 09-22-2008, 05:22 PM #6 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bigstock2001
I agree on the min raise on the turn, however I am sure he would have called any raise I dont think there is any way i could have avoided him from going all in. I just feel there might have been a better way to control the pot. I honestly feel i was destined to loose this hand.
If he would have called any raise then raise bigger on the flop. The only hand that beats you is 64 and most people don't play that shit. And why in the world would you want to control the pot??? You have the 2nd nuts right now, and rarely will anyone ever show up with 64 there. I'm guessing he had either 22,33 and the 5 on the turn filled up his boat. You were ahead when the money went in so stop second guessing whether to felt or not.
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bigstock2001
Old 09-22-2008, 05:23 PM     Post subject: raise more preflop #7 (permalink)  
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The pot was limped so you are right with my position i should have put about 4xbb out there. didn't do that. He may have not called with his poket pair the read on the player i had was a solid player. I knew went all in he had trips two pair at min. I knew he was not on a draw. thanks for some advice. Maybe with me knowing that he had trips i should have laid it down. Not sure.

Don
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cardsman1992
Old 09-22-2008, 05:23 PM #8 (permalink)  
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In this particular hand you don't want the pot small. When you are ahead in the hand, you want him to call any bet that is large enough to deny him odds to draw to a better hand. If you think he is drawing to a flush, he has 9 outs. For a boat, he has 7 outs on the turn and 10 on the river. You are most likely ahead 60/40, so you have to deny him better than 1.5:1 odds.

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cardsman1992
Old 09-22-2008, 05:25 PM     Post subject: Re: raise more preflop #9 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bigstock2001
I knew went all in he had trips two pair at min. I knew he was not on a draw. thanks for some advice. Maybe with me knowing that he had trips i should have laid it down. Not sure.

Don
NOOOOOOOOO........
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bigstock2001
Old 09-22-2008, 05:28 PM #10 (permalink)  
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so in that aspect i did play it right. It was just bad luck. SO in your guys opinion the only thing i really did wrong is

No preflop raise from position
and Min. Raise the turn even though the outcome is what i should really want is his all in call.

Would you guys make the same call to someone you know is on a flush draw on the flop and you hold KK or in this case you would want to hold the control of the pot
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Trashcona
Old 09-22-2008, 05:37 PM     Post subject: Re: raise more preflop #11 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bigstock2001
...Maybe with me knowing that he had trips i should have laid it down. Not sure.
Even if MP3 played with his cards face up and we saw a set, we'd still get it all in here. You're ahead not to mention he's only 60bb's deep. This is exactly what we hope for when we flop a monster.
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Stacks
Old 09-22-2008, 05:45 PM #12 (permalink)  
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 A straight bets a set. As stated, you are only an underdog to 64. You are currently ahead of 22,33,55, or a flush draw. You HAVE to felt the flop. You can't lay down your hand here ever, cuz it's the "nuts" right. However, it is vulnerable and you do want to raise him and try to felt the flop.

However, while you shouldn't have limped behind preflop, I don't hate a raise preflop. But I fold this often. If there wasn't an EP limper I would raise, and if it was suited I would raise. But given alot of people like to limp/raise at the micros, I would just toss this hand preflop I do believe.

And on the flop you need to raise bigger.
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spoonitnow
Old 09-22-2008, 08:00 PM #13 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cardsman1992
In this particular hand you don't want the pot small. When you are ahead in the hand, you want him to call any bet that is large enough to deny him odds to draw to a better hand. If you think he is drawing to a flush, he has 9 outs. For a boat, he has 7 outs on the turn and 10 on the river. You are most likely ahead 60/40, so you have to deny him better than 1.5:1 odds.

Spend $30 and buy NLH: T&P. It's well worth your while...
Or e-mail me at jesseeddleman yahoo.com and I'll give you a RapidShare link to the PDF.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ripptyde
I only have 2 simple rules when I am coaching a new student.

Rule # 1: don't ask questions

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I have no interest in discussing strategy with a protege'. Your job is to remain quiet and listen. I have a very systematic approach that I will share with the right candidate and I promise that I will turn you into a force of nature and show you elements of the game of poker that you never knew existed.
 
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spoonitnow
Old 09-22-2008, 08:02 PM #14 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by XxStacksxX
A straight bets a set. As stated, you are only an underdog to 64. You are currently ahead of 22,33,55, or a flush draw. You HAVE to felt the flop. You can't lay down your hand here ever, cuz it's the "nuts" right. However, it is vulnerable and you do want to raise him and try to felt the flop.

However, while you shouldn't have limped behind preflop, I don't hate a raise preflop. But I fold this often. If there wasn't an EP limper I would raise, and if it was suited I would raise. But given alot of people like to limp/raise at the micros, I would just toss this hand preflop I do believe.

And on the flop you need to raise bigger.
Just a random bit, but I would prefer to raise preflop with A5o and limp with A5s, doucy?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ripptyde
I only have 2 simple rules when I am coaching a new student.

Rule # 1: don't ask questions

Rule # 2: don't ask questions

I have no interest in discussing strategy with a protege'. Your job is to remain quiet and listen. I have a very systematic approach that I will share with the right candidate and I promise that I will turn you into a force of nature and show you elements of the game of poker that you never knew existed.
 
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Old 09-22-2008, 08:46 PM #15 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by spoonitnow
Quote:
Originally Posted by cardsman1992
In this particular hand you don't want the pot small. When you are ahead in the hand, you want him to call any bet that is large enough to deny him odds to draw to a better hand. If you think he is drawing to a flush, he has 9 outs. For a boat, he has 7 outs on the turn and 10 on the river. You are most likely ahead 60/40, so you have to deny him better than 1.5:1 odds.

Spend $30 and buy NLH: T&P. It's well worth your while...
Or e-mail me at jesseeddleman :at: yahoo.com and I'll give you a RapidShare link to the PDF.
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pilipolio
Old 09-22-2008, 08:46 PM     Post subject: Re: raise more preflop #16 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cardsman1992
Quote:
Originally Posted by bigstock2001
I knew went all in he had trips two pair at min. I knew he was not on a draw. thanks for some advice. Maybe with me knowing that he had trips i should have laid it down. Not sure.

Don
NOOOOOOOOO........
said in a longer way :

poker stove it

Board: 2c 3c 5d
Dead:

equity win tie pots won pots tied
Hand 0: 63.507% 62.47% 01.04% 5566 92.50 { Ad4s }
Hand 1: 36.493% 35.45% 01.04% 3159 92.50 { 55, 33-22 }

you are nicely ahead, put the money in and be happy with it. It is even better if you add two pairs and flush draws in opponent's range.

Pokerstove is a really cool tool (and free too) to make your mind straight.

Personnaly I fold 100% of the time, lots of players will limp call with better aces. I might sometimes raise wi suited aces.
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Stacks
Old 09-22-2008, 08:57 PM #17 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spoonitnow
Quote:
Originally Posted by XxStacksxX
A straight bets a set. As stated, you are only an underdog to 64. You are currently ahead of 22,33,55, or a flush draw. You HAVE to felt the flop. You can't lay down your hand here ever, cuz it's the "nuts" right. However, it is vulnerable and you do want to raise him and try to felt the flop.

However, while you shouldn't have limped behind preflop, I don't hate a raise preflop. But I fold this often. If there wasn't an EP limper I would raise, and if it was suited I would raise. But given alot of people like to limp/raise at the micros, I would just toss this hand preflop I do believe.

And on the flop you need to raise bigger.
Just a random bit, but I would prefer to raise preflop with A5o and limp with A5s, doucy?
I see what your saying. Your right, my bad.
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bjsaust
Old 09-22-2008, 11:54 PM #18 (permalink)  
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I'm sure its been covered, but download pokerstove and start running hands. You're a solid favorite over 2P or trips here. The fact he improved AFTER the money went in doesnt change the fact that you were the favorite when it went in. The only hand he can flip face up and you'd fold to is 46 here.
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