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r8ed
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02-21-2006, 06:48 PM
Post subject: AK/AQ vs. unders
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#1 (permalink)
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 1,524
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I know this is read dependant, but against unknowns...
You raise in position with AK/AQ and get a couple callers. The flop comes out with 3 unders (rainbow) and one guy pots it ahead of you. Do you bother calling or reraising?
What if:
a) two suited unders
b) two connectors
c) other caller ahead of you
Think about how much your hand can improve to make this worthwhile. If you spike an Ace, are you ahead or will that cost you more?
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Lodogg
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Straight
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Stealing your C-bet
Posts: 199
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This is definitely read dependant....but think why would someone make a pot sized raise UTG. I would think that the player either has a small overpair or is on a pure bluff. I could see valid arguments for raising and folding. Calling is probably your worst move, because you will not be able to gain information. I would probably let it go if someone cold calls that bet ahead of me.
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natdang
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Flush
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 380
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I agree, it is read dependent, but at the low stakes I play ($25 and $50NL), it's usually not worth a reraise. Unless you're trying to maintain a really aggressive table image.
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Renton
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Straight Flush
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Atlanta, GA, USA
Posts: 5,991
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by natdang
I agree, it is read dependent, but at the low stakes I play ($25 and $50NL), it's usually not worth a reraise. Unless you're trying to maintain a really aggressive table image.
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At the 25NL I love making the reraise play for variety on occasion. Maybe one out of every 5 or 6 cases where someone bets into me from utg on the flop, I will raise 2.5x and see what happens (regardless of my hole cards, but with a middle pair or something I might be more proponent to do this with my five emergency outs).
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Vrax
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Full House
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Poland
Posts: 632
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Muck it. The guy potting it into you is basically representing some kind of made hand (because flop is drawless) and you are 30/70 underdog at best (if he has only a piece of it) or drawing dead if he flopped a monster set. Not good spot to chase overcards. Mucking unimproved overs against reasonable pressure is "standard book ABC" play.
However, that donk-betting can be exploited and bring some more value if opponent is prone to lead into a raiser with large variety of hands...
If he donk-bets every piece of flop&draw trying to push you off, you can try to smooth-call him on flop with overpair and pull the trigger on turn (if you have position). If he often folds to your flop-raises (when you are legit, like overpair ot tptk) then you can pick that read and consider to raise or checkraise him with air. But doing it without solid read is just not a solid poker 
BTW...
That restaurant-owner (I can't remember his name) from High Stakes Poker EP6 did that stuff beautifully, when he checkraised his AQ against Nassirei's bet. Few hands later he made moderate hand, pair of tens from his AT and check-called two huge bets from the same player and dragged big pot when Nassirei mucked his Ace high junk. Reads
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"How could I call that bet? How could you MAKE that bet? It's poker not solitaire. " - that Gus Bronson guy
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Krieg1984
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02-22-2006, 09:52 AM
Post subject: Re: AK/AQ vs. unders
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#6 (permalink)
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Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 93
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by r8ed
I know this is read dependant, but against unknowns...
You raise in position with AK/AQ and get a couple callers. The flop comes out with 3 unders (rainbow) and one guy pots it ahead of you. Do you bother calling or reraising?
What if:
a) two suited unders
b) two connectors
c) other caller ahead of you
Think about how much your hand can improve to make this worthwhile. If you spike an Ace, are you ahead or will that cost you more?
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Most of the times I just muck, but I'll write notes about this player. If I see this sort of thing happening again in a similiar situation, I'll raise. If I get played back at, I'm folding, but more importantly I'll learn that his lead bets on the flop probably aren't horseplay.
A decent/good player though could probably make this play with say TT or 99. He thinks he probably has the best hand, but a good raise from you represents a hand like AA, KK, or QQ and could just be the motivation he needs to fold.
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Lukie: "Yo Fnord I was playing omaha earlier"
Lukie: "I got dealt quads"
Lukie: "but everyone folded to my raise  "
Lukie: "I was going to pwn everyone"
Fnord: "Gotta slowplay them big hands man..."
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Miffed22001
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Straight Flush
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Marry Me Cheryl!!!
Posts: 8,181
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leave him to pot it
then open with AA/kk or a pp and flop a set and go to work on it.
A play i see time and again from aggressive players is potting a raggedy flop into a preflop raiser. It is an 'ok' play if you have a good hand and can put preflop raiser on an overpair which he may overplay but often the preflop raiser can reraise and ask the original bettor to make a tough decision ifr his hand isnt great. Its horrible post flop play imo, the check raise is so much more effective/profitable/and less respected by many poker players. Its an exellent case of where position can play another players cards for him.
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