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AA - A flopped, well played or just a weak opponent?

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MightyMarc

10-09-2006, 01:33 AM Post subject: AA - A flopped, well played or just a weak opponent?

#1 (permalink)

Join Date: Oct 2006

Posts: 23

Hello to the FTP community,

I would like to post a game I played this night. Well finally got the money but I ask myself two questions:

1. Was it a good idea to bet 4xBB and then reraise?
Would a good player have noticed that my small bet together with th reraise was just a maneuver and fold?

2. Should I, in such a situation, go all-in after the flop to avoid an embarrassing situation (imagine a Jack on the river, my opponent had QQ)?

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $0.25 BB (6 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver Cards)

MP ($12.80)
CO ($24.20)
Button ($11.80)
Hero ($25.15)
BB ($13.35)
UTG ($24.72)

Preflop: Hero is SB with

. Hero posts a blind of $0.10. UTG posts a blind of $0.35.
UTG (poster) checks, MP calls $0.25, CO raises to $2, 1 fold, Hero (poster) raises to $3.9, 1 fold, UTG folds, MP folds, CO calls $2.

Flop: ($8.85)

(2 players)
Hero bets $1, CO raises to $2, Hero raises to $5, CO calls $3.

Turn: ($18.85)

(2 players)
Hero bets $16.15 (All-In), CO calls $15.20 (All-In).

River: ($46.80)

(2 players, 2 All-In)

Final Pot: $46.80

Results in white below:
Hero has Ad As (three of a kind, aces).
CO has Qc Qh (a pair of queens).
Outcome: Hero wins $46.80.

Thanks a lot for any comment

Marc

P.S.: I had to edit the hand report since the bets at turn were not converted. And sorry for my bad english, never used it since school.

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TLR

10-09-2006, 06:50 AM

#2 (permalink)

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I will probably rereraise the turn a bit more, he has shown interest in the hand, there are a lot of draws out, reraise 1/2 pot

rethuglican

10-09-2006, 06:51 AM

#3 (permalink)

Join Date: Oct 2006

Location: London, ON

Posts: 17

I'd have re-raised more preflop. I'd have raised it to at least $6. I'm much more likely to raise it to $8. I don't like varying my betting based on my cards. If I'm going to raise, I raise 4xbb (+1bb/limper) preflop whether I am raising with Ts or raising with As. Same rule applies to re-raising as far as I'm concerned.

If someone notices that my re-raises are 4x the original raise and then see that this time I only min-raised or even 3x... flags go off. Why would I do that? I want a call. Why would I want a call? I have a monster. Keeping those raises, re-raises consistent keeps them from knowing exactly what I'm re-raising with.

Betting post flop should be consistent as well. 3/4 pot bet after the flop would be enough to not give your opponent the odds to continue on a draw. Your $1 bet into an $8 pot is the best thing in the world to a LAG who called your raise with his 45s hearts. He's got the odds to call it and your trip As are going down to a flush.

If you get re-raised, then I'm all for an all-in. You have the nuts. If your opponent is on a draw, he's being very reckless putting all of his money on the line praying that a draw will come through for him and you'll make way more money on such a play than you'll ever lose.

That's my $0.02 at least... but I'm just a lowly micro-level player. So perhaps that's all bunk as you rise up the ranks.

TLR

10-09-2006, 06:51 AM

#4 (permalink)

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I would also lead out harder on the flop, 1/2 pot

andy-akb

10-09-2006, 07:06 AM

#5 (permalink)

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Posts: 1,836

Your PF reraise is very small, I think its a minraise. Make a real raise here, Id make it $6.

As played I bet the full pot on the flop, atleast $6, betting $1 gives any possible hand the odds needed to profitably call. A raise, if you play it as I suggested, will be all-in, which you should obviously call. If they just call your bet on the flop then jsut push the turn.

You got it all in with the best hand, but I dont think you played it well enough to maximize agaisnt your opponents range. At these small stakes, playing a hand as strong as this is just asking to get drawn out.

MightyMarc

10-09-2006, 10:33 AM

#6 (permalink)

Join Date: Oct 2006

Posts: 23

To summarize:

I should have raised the preflop much more to avoid a mad man seeing the flop.
And a stronger raise on the flop is recommended not to give my opponent the chance to get a draw.

I see, receiving comments from experienced players makes me think about tactics much more than just staring at the hand historie.

Thanks a lot.

Marc

sejje

10-09-2006, 08:14 PM

#7 (permalink)

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I think you were very lucky to stack QQ on that board. It takes a terrible player to lose a stack there.

Definitely get more in preflop. Most every player at that level will felt with queens. Why wait until there's a scary flop to push him out of the pot?

benny999

10-10-2006, 03:21 AM

#8 (permalink)

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What seije wrote -- that you want to bet/raise bigger to build a bigger pot, in case he has a hand like he had -- is a key point imo, since a lot of beginners are too concerned with making ppl fold when you get a big hand.

Remember you're playing his cards too, and if he folds pre flop, don't worry -- he probably had junk anyways and was only going to give you action post flop if he could beat one pair. But if he has AK or TT+, you'll get his stack easier post flop by making the pot start off big.

FlyingSaucy

10-10-2006, 04:10 AM

#9 (permalink)

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for a low level game with plenty of fish, it wasn't played badly at all, just a little weak.

MightyMarc

10-10-2006, 11:38 AM Post subject: Better this time or even worst?

#10 (permalink)

Join Date: Oct 2006

Posts: 23

This time against an extremly LAG player. Beginner's luck I wasn't dashed to pieces or the best I could do? The opponent was very weak, spending (this match included) 3 complete stacks within 15 minutes.

$25 NL Texas Hold'em - Tuesday, October 10, 07:21:55 ET 2006

Seat 5 is the button

Seat 1: XorTheMighty ( $7.78 )
Seat 2: toplots ( $33.77 )
Seat 3: eiummarra ( $14.72 )
Seat 5: jenthebud ( $22.50 )
Seat 6: Lakshmi7 ( $28.55 )
Seat 4: aibmoloc ( $22.45 )

Lakshmi7 posts small blind [$0.10].
XorTheMighty posts big blind [$0.25].
Dealt to aibmoloc [ Ac Ad ]
toplots folds.
eiummarra folds.
aibmoloc raises [$3].
jenthebud folds.
Lakshmi7 raises [$5.65].
XorTheMighty folds.
aibmoloc is all-In [$19.45]
Lakshmi7 calls [$16.70].

** Dealing Flop ** [ Jh, 9d, Tc ]
** Dealing Turn ** [ 7h ]
** Dealing River ** [ Td ]

Lakshmi7 shows [ Kd, Ah ] a pair of tens.
aibmoloc shows [ Ac, Ad ] two pairs, aces and tens.
aibmoloc wins $42.90 from the main pot with two pairs, aces and tens.

pokerroomace

10-11-2006, 11:31 AM Post subject: Re: Better this time or even worst?

#11 (permalink)

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Quote:

Originally Posted by MightyMarc

I think you overbet preflop. You raised 12x BB in 1st position at a 6 handed table? You're lucky you got a caller. I would have raised about 3xBB probably. The rest of the hand is alright though. Maybe I'd reraise a little less after you've already been reraised. But allin is alright.

For the first hand I agree with the other comments. I don't like the min reraise PF. I would have raised to between $6 and $8. And on the flop I don't like the tiny bet you made. If he's drawing you're giving him a free card. But is an acceptable play. It's a slowplay with the nuts. It's a variation of the check-raise (the $1 bet PF is so small it's like a check). The $1 could induce a raise if your opponent thinks it shows weakness. So it's not too bad.

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MightyMarc

10-11-2006, 01:22 PM Post subject: Re: Better this time or even worst?

#12 (permalink)

Join Date: Oct 2006

Posts: 23

Quote:

Originally Posted by pokerroomace

I think you overbet preflop. You raised 12x BB in 1st position at a 6 handed table? You're lucky you got a caller. I would have raised about 3xBB probably.

Well the point is that there were 2 or 3 people at the table calling a 3xBB raise with maybe 89, QJ or something similar.

Quote:

It's a slowplay with the nuts. It's a variation of the check-raise (the $1 bet PF is so small it's like a check). The $1 could induce a raise if your opponent thinks it shows weakness.

This was my intention. I put the opponent on something like TT to QQ so I was afraid a strong bet would have scared him. The last thing I want to see in the flop with a pair like TT to QQ is K and/or A since at the $25 tables there are a lot of people doing stupid things with a baby ace suited, AT or similar hands. I hoped he would have raised more than just to $2 (maybe $3-4) to reraise up t $8-10 Dollars making him commited. But this didn't work.

WhooFleuryScores

10-16-2006, 04:16 AM

#13 (permalink)

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I try to get it all in on the flop.

Muzzard

10-19-2006, 02:43 PM

#14 (permalink)

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I'd agree with the majority of the posts here, definitely re-raise more pre flop. Make it $6-10, you want to limit the amount of hands that would call as there are still 4 people in the hand after you.

Making such a raise will then make a read on your opponents easier. With the minraise that you made, it is definitely harder to put your opponents on a hand. if he calls the 6-10 then really you can put him on AK/1010+ unless he's a bit of a donk or likes taking big risks with lower pockets.

If he re-re-raises back to you after your $6-$10, then your in a perfect position to go all-in and get called with the nutz preflop.

Post flop.... yeah I know you've flopped teh nut hand, but if you are going to bet it, make it 2/3's ish. If you check and CO bets, its a tough call between flat calling and reraising the danger hand is flush draw, so I would probably reraise and go all in

With the ten on the turn if it had gone check check, go all in.

IMO this is extremely bad play by the Villian, instant fold on the flop when you rereraised, though I would have reraised Hero on the flop with $1 bet when you rereraised to $5 i know my QQ is pants

Few flaws in your play, but the Villian was stupid he could have saved $19 by folding after the flop rereraise.

jackvance

10-23-2006, 10:12 PM

#15 (permalink)

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Sometimes it's cool that people could have easily stacked me but used a check/reraise line which allowed me to find a fold lol..

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MightyMarc

10-26-2006, 01:15 PM

#16 (permalink)

Join Date: Oct 2006

Posts: 23

Now an example of what I consider as one of my worst folds:

Seat 5 is the button
Total number of players : 5
Seat 5: Renars21 ( $4.09 )
Seat 3: aibmoloc ( $59.62 )
Seat 2: vino55 ( $12.75 )
Seat 6: lucyd222 ( $29.70 )
Seat 1: Claude40 ( $10 )
lucyd222 posts small blind [$0.10].
Claude40 posts big blind [$0.25].
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to aibmoloc [ 9d 8d ]
vino55 raises [$0.50].
aibmoloc calls [$0.50].
Renars21 calls [$0.50].
lucyd222 calls [$0.40].
Claude40 calls [$0.25].
** Dealing Flop ** [ 8c, Qd, 7d ]
lucyd222 checks.
Claude40 bets [$2].
vino55 folds.
aibmoloc calls [$2].
Renars21 folds.
lucyd222 folds.
** Dealing Turn ** [ 4h ]
Claude40 bets [$4].
aibmoloc folds.

Psychology of missing the turn. Do you ignore in such a situation the turn? I always tend to become a little bit nervous when I miss the turn and have to pray for the river.
Since I havent played many hands (about 20K) variance scared me. I already had some drawing hands which didnt complete and cost me a lot of money. Irrelevant? Should I just trust in math and likelihood?

Was it a bad idea to call on the flop because villiant was a low stack and so there wasnt a lot to win?

jyms

10-26-2006, 03:05 PM

#17 (permalink)

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Join Date: Feb 2006

Posts: 4,836

Quote:

Hero is SB with

, . Hero posts a blind of $0.10. UTG posts a blind of $0.35.

I love playing at tables with these guys. Absolutely the worst players at any table. The only thing that's a more tell tale sign of BAD POKER PLAYER is if he buys in with $8.37

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MightyMarc

10-26-2006, 05:07 PM

#18 (permalink)

Join Date: Oct 2006

Posts: 23

Sorry Trainer but I didn't get the point (maybe due to my bad english). Searched for the log and found the following:

Joe_Momma999 posts big blind + dead [$0.35]

What does that mean? Thanks in advance.

jyms

10-26-2006, 05:25 PM

#19 (permalink)

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He paid $0.35 cents to sit at the table, fold one hand from out of position and then had to pay the blinds in the following two hands. If he had of waited one hand it would have been the BB. It cost him $0.80 cents for the first orbit.

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Xanadu

10-26-2006, 05:59 PM

#20 (permalink)

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Actually, in hand 2, opponent's play wasn't really so bad. Calling may be more prudent than reraising for him, but he has odds to call the allin as long as AK is in your range. Even if AK is not in your range, he has odds if you are playing TT+. He's only in horrible shape if you only play KK+ here. There are enough donkeys out there with wide enough pushing ranges that calling the all-in at a 6-handed table is very reasonable.

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