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5NL: What does this river bet mean?

  
 
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tiswin
Old 10-31-2009, 10:13 PM     Post subject: 5NL: What does this river bet mean? #1 (permalink)  
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tiswin
Id appreciate some advice with this hand. Im sorry but I cant post the converted hand until I have 10 posts since the converter has links in, so im going to have to do some shameless self bumping. Please skip to the post at the bottom.
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tiswin
Old 10-31-2009, 10:14 PM #2 (permalink)  
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tiswin
seven
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tiswin
Old 10-31-2009, 10:14 PM #3 (permalink)  
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tiswin
eight
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tiswin
Old 10-31-2009, 10:14 PM #4 (permalink)  
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tiswin
nine
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tiswin
Old 10-31-2009, 10:15 PM #5 (permalink)  
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tiswin
ten
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tiswin
Old 10-31-2009, 10:15 PM #6 (permalink)  
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tiswin
There. Sorry about that but it wouldnt let me post . Anyway heres the hand.

BB:VPIP 24 PFR 20

I ran out of ideas with the river bet here. Any thoughts most welcome.

No-Limit Hold'em, $0.05 BB (6 handed) -

Button ($14.06)
SB ($8.54)
BB ($10)
UTG ($7.31)
MP ($10.07)
Hero (CO) ($5.91)

Preflop: Hero is CO with A, Q
2 folds, Hero bets $0.20, 2 folds, BB calls $0.15

Flop: ($0.42) Q, 9, 4 (2 players)
BB checks, Hero bets $0.30, BB calls $0.30

what calls? QJ, QK, TJ, T9 possibly TT ...

Turn: ($1.02) 10 (2 players)
BB checks, Hero bets $0.60, BB calls $0.60

I don't know how to read this call.

River: ($2.22) 2 (2 players)
BB bets $1.40, Hero.....?
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argash
Old 10-31-2009, 10:28 PM #7 (permalink)  
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Preflop should bet 5BB as played flop bet should be some where between .35-.39 at this point the turn will become irrelevant as you would not have been giving him odds to hit his draw if that's what he's on
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WeaselT
Old 11-01-2009, 12:19 AM #8 (permalink)  
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WeaselT is an unknown quantity at this point
 24/20, hmm dunno could even be some weird Qx combo or maybe even QQ/99/44 u left out. River is funky that he bets but im thinkin like Str8, 2P, possibly poorly played set. Thinkin u behind tho having only TPTK.
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Outlaw
Old 11-01-2009, 12:38 AM #9 (permalink)  
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This is a good hand to practice ABCD theorem.

Do you think your hand is A, B, C, or D after the flop? And depending on which, what do you think your best play is in position on the flop, turn, and river?

BTW this is a very common situation, so mastering these types of spots will put you way ahead of the game. Remember to keep stack sizes and commitment in mind.
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mbiz
Old 11-01-2009, 01:13 AM #10 (permalink)  
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 ok im rereading that ABCD theorem because of your suggestion re. this hand outlaw, so ill take a stab (and embarrass myself as usual).

I think on the flop the hand is an A (TPTK on an ok flop) and I like a flop bet.

Turn downgrades to a B because it hits a TT set as well as straight draws so check back and reassess the river?

i also feel that this turn check makes a river bet by villain more likely regardless of holding, since he might think the flop bet was just a Cbet with rubbish, which makes call or check on river ok.


aight, shoot me down! :3
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WeaselT
Old 11-01-2009, 01:00 AM #11 (permalink)  
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 sounds good to me, sucks giving a free card but that board hits SO much sh!t already. small hand/small pot, big hand/big pot.
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Outlaw
Old 11-01-2009, 03:03 AM #12 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mbiz
ok im rereading that ABCD theorem because of your suggestion re. this hand outlaw, so ill take a stab (and embarrass myself as usual).

I think on the flop the hand is an A (TPTK on an ok flop) and I like a flop bet.

Turn downgrades to a B because it hits a TT set as well as straight draws so check back and reassess the river?

i also feel that this turn check makes a river bet by villain more likely regardless of holding, since he might think the flop bet was just a Cbet with rubbish, which makes call or check on river ok.


aight, shoot me down! :3
Overall pretty good imo.

I am still learning this stuff myself but my ranges are.

Flop
A- AA, KK, QQ, Q9, A4, 99, 44, AQ, KQ- Hands I bet and continue to a raise
B- QJ, Q10, A9, K9, 109, J9, 98, JJ, 1010, 88, 77, 66, 55, 33, 22- hands I check for deception, pot control, and showdown value
C- J10, A4, x4, J8, KJ, K10, 108- Hands I bet/call and raise/shove turns we improve or if there's a scare card for villain's range.
D- Complete air- Hands I check

This of course varies for different opponents, I am basing my range on the limited info of a 24/20 loose/unk (dunno if agro or passive). but basically I am playing my A and C range the same as well as my B and D range the same.

After getting called on the turn I adjust my ranges due to villain's call.

A- KJ, Q10, Q9, 109, QQ, 1010, 99, 44- Hands I bet and continue to a raise
B- QJ, A9, A4, AQ, KQ, K9, Q9, 98, 88, 77, 66, 55, 33, 22, X4- hands I check for pot control and showdown value
C- JJ, QJ, J10, J9, J8, KJ, K10, 108, Axh, Kxh, Qxh, Jxh- Hands I bet/call and raise/shove rivers we improve or if there's a scare card for villain's range.
D- Complete air- Hands I bet/fold- If we get called it sets us up for a bluff on the river.

Notice by the turn I am playing 3 of my ranges exactly the same. And if the villain leads out on the river no matter what happens we can either call a small percentage of our stack off for showdown value or raise if we hit a big hand or as a bluff with our D range.

Also some of the hands might move around if I had more info.. this is very generic here.

Man this is hard by the way lol
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inV1NCEble
Old 11-01-2009, 12:15 PM #13 (permalink)  
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inV1NCEble
Turnbet seems fine by me, the T only hits JK,QT,TT (and maybe T9 and J8)
Giving a free card here seems bad imho. Almost his entire flopcalling range has picked up a straightdraw (+ 5 outs for trips or 2p) which he will call your bet with. So betting for value/protection seems vital to me..

As always I'll be happily corrected..

OMG POKERTRACKER IS RIGGED!
 
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mbiz
Old 11-01-2009, 10:02 PM #14 (permalink)  
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 yeah good point
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