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4NL FH Range check

  
 
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ButtonMash
Old 08-26-2010, 10:44 AM     Post subject: 4NL FH Range check #1 (permalink)  
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 Villain plays 15/14 with 4% 3bet over 400+ hands, seems like a careful winner.
He probably sees me as a bit looser.
Table has been fairly tight, I limp with 44 for setmining.
He raises from SB so I put him on TT+, AQo+, AJs+.
Bingo on the flop,and when he bets I call, not wanting to scare him off too early.
The turn brings a flush draw so when he leads again my plan is to call and make a bluffy looking bet on the river.
At this point I think he has a K and might put me on a flushdraw.
Then the A falls on the river. I can't see many cards he will have with Kx's other than AK.
This leaves AA, QQ (maybe JJ TT) or a winning full house. I'd appreciate some critiques on my ranges and thoughts. (or should I just bet bet bet)

$0.02/$0.04 No Limit Holdem

4 Players
Hand Conversion Powered by weaktight.com

Stacks:
Hero ($4.47)
BTN ($4.16)
SB ($4.79)
BB ($4.41)

Pre-Flop: ($0.06, 4 players) Hero is CO
Hero calls $0.04, 1 fold, SB raises to $0.20, 1 fold, Hero calls $0.16

Flop: ($0.44, 2 players)
SB bets $0.28, Hero calls $0.28

Turn: ($1, 2 players)
SB bets $0.63, Hero calls $0.63

River: ($2.26, 2 players)
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rong
Old 08-26-2010, 12:54 PM #2 (permalink)  
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 Raise flop.

I don't like slow playing. If you want to disguise your hand, bluff more in general.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Micro2Macro View Post
hey guys, if you ever make a snap call on the river when your opponent raises you're fucking retarded.

Fucking. Retarded.
 
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Penneywize
Old 08-26-2010, 02:30 PM #3 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ButtonMash View Post
Table has been fairly tight, I limp with 44 for setmining.
Seriously, don't do that. Raise pre. Why limp with a small pp? if you bink your set, and the pot goes unraised pre, you're generally going to have a hell of a time getting value in. Also you may often give other players as well as the BB a cheap or free look at the flop, and 44 plays shitty multi-way.


EDIT: Realized this was 4-handed which probably makes limping here much worse. Please raise.
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Penneywize
Old 08-26-2010, 02:51 PM #4 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Then the A falls on the river. I can't see many cards he will have with Kx's other than AK.
You're playing 4-handed and you limped; his preflop raise doesn't limit him to TT+, AQ+. I could see as low as KTs raising here if he feels you're playing a very wide range and that KT is ahead of it.

As for the rest of the hand, raise somewhere jfc. Like the flop. Or if you failed to do that, the turn. Just get it in already. If this is a cold deck, no, you couldn't really have gotten away from it, and it's a real travesty that it took you so long (I assume you did on the river) to stack off in this hand.
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JKDS
Old 08-26-2010, 03:21 PM #5 (permalink)  
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 What did he do on the river?

Slowplaying here is fine so long as we get it in on the river imo
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But no, jkds is lolvillager and anyone who wants to string him up is sighbad.
 
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Imthenewfish
Old 08-26-2010, 06:00 PM #6 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JKDS View Post
What did he do on the river?

Slowplaying here is fine so long as we get it in on the river imo
++++++++++++++++++++++++1
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Penneywize
Old 08-26-2010, 06:12 PM #7 (permalink)  
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 yeah I guess if you're ever going to slowplay, having a flopped full house probably isn't the worst time to do it (unless you're missing value I suppose). But facing multiple streets of aggression I just feel like we can get it in without belaboring things. Turn seems best if we feel like he's dumb enough to stack off some draws... not sure how plausible these are but AxAd QxQd JxJd TxTd etc would be in there?

basically what i'm driving at is isn't there more potential combos villain will stack with on the turn than on the river -

or, at least, willingness to call a raise on turn > willingness to call big bet or raise on river?

as it is we have to raise on river, or overbet if checked to...

if I'm being retarded please point this out
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Icanhastreebet
Old 08-26-2010, 06:23 PM #8 (permalink)  
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 pretty sure it's super standard to call,call,shove IP here especially since your calling with MOST of your range and this keeps your range the widest but that's a whole different point all together.

Calling also keeps his range the widest(bluffs,semi-bluffs, all his Kx we'll still stack eventually, smaller pairs).

The only way not slowplaying would be better is if villain isn't going to bluff later streets and is willing to continue w/ flush draws once we raise flop/turn or w/e. Once the flush gets there you can probably just try and get it in now before another diamond comes off or w/e. But shove the river for sure once he bets or just bet something small when checked to.
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Icanhastreebet
Old 08-26-2010, 06:25 PM #9 (permalink)  
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 Also don't open limp here pre.
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Penneywize
Old 08-26-2010, 06:41 PM #10 (permalink)  
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 Thanks yaawn, nice detailed response.
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ButtonMash
Old 08-26-2010, 07:35 PM #11 (permalink)  
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 Thanks to all for your advice. I knew I played it badly which is why I wanted comments.
Once the A dropped I got stuck with the idea that he had AK and checked it thru.
Opportunity missed.
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kfaess
Old 08-26-2010, 07:38 PM #12 (permalink)  
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 yea nice response yaawn. Here is what I was trying to say in irc:

Let's say we don't actually have a FH on the flop and instead of betting he c/r us. What would be the worst hand you're continuing with here? I think what u said earlier was that calling his raise is better than getting it in on the flop so he can still keep bluffing (with a hand like 99).

Also, what if you're playing someone halfway decent who prob won't bluff without at least some equity. What are you doing if he c/r us on flop then the Diamond card hits, or an A/Q hits and he barrels? Is this too general and too opponent specific?
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Illfavor
Old 08-26-2010, 10:05 PM #13 (permalink)  
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 kfaess it depends on what our opponents c/r range looks like
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kfaess
Old 08-27-2010, 01:20 AM #14 (permalink)  
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 yea I realize Illfavor but like if the person is decent then we assume they're not going to c/r us on flop with a K/FH/any good made hand really. So if u see a decent player do this on this flop then do u assume its a bluff/semibluff a lot of the time??
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