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martindcx1e
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09-20-2006, 05:56 AM
Post subject: 3-Bet Flop vs. Call/Lead Turn
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#1 (permalink)
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 3,614
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I think there may have been a thread about this awhile back so sorry if this is redundant. I've noticed that I (and probably many others) have a ridiculously small 3bet range on the flop OOP. There are many times like with TPTK (EDIT: Or Overpair) where I bet out, get minraised, call, and lead the turn, and I think many of you use this line as well with similar hands - correct me if I'm wrong. I was thinking though that it's usually cheaper to 3bet the flop, and it seems to me that villain would usually fold/raise after this...am I assuming correctly here? I think this would also help disguise monsters better that we like to 3bet on the flop usually. Is this all common knowledge already or is the call/lead line just better for some reason?
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TerryToma
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09-20-2006, 06:08 AM
Post subject: Re: 3-Bet Flop vs. Call/Lead Turn
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#2 (permalink)
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Full House
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: wisconsin
Posts: 823
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by martindcx1e
I think there may have been a thread about this awhile back so sorry if this is redundant. I've noticed that I (and probably many others) have a ridiculously small 3bet range on the flop OOP. There are many times like with TPTK where I bet out, get minraised, call, and lead the turn, and I think many of you use this line as well with similar hands - correct me if I'm wrong. I was thinking though that it's usually cheaper to 3bet the flop, and it seems to me that villain would usually fold/raise after this...am I assuming correctly here? I think this would also help disguise monsters better that we like to 3bet on the flop usually. Is this all common knowledge already or is the call/lead line just better for some reason?
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as a general rule, at 25NL, a c/r or reraise on the flop is a bit scary. i try to show down cheap with TPTK. if you have a read/history with someone is on a draw then perhaps you can do this on a blank turn vs 3bet flop.
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benny999
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 1,567
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I don't understand 3betting the flop with tptk/overpairs on a real dry board without a maniac read. I think many times a flop raise means opp has not much (seeing where they're at), or something big. A 3bet will fold the not much, but call and lead/fold or check/reevaluate the turn wins more against that range, especially since most will never bluff in a medium-big pot.
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Miffed22001
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Straight Flush
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Marry Me Cheryl!!!
Posts: 8,181
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if you get raised on the flop call and lead a blank turn on draw boards. You dont want to really 3bet. You fold worse hands nearly always and have to call a push from a better hand which is much worse.
This discussion rumbled on i think when Renton was fairly new and revamped a lot of ideas i personally had on 3-betting flops on draw boards.
The only real time i call a raise on a dry board and lead the turn is if i have an unobvious overpair on a raggy board (i.e my flop bet looks c-bettish) or if my hand is semi-hidden (i.e i actually have AK on Kxx rainbow and not whiffed AQ)
Other than that the only time id three bet the flop is when i kniw my hand is going to call an all in, i.e AK on AKx with a flush draw etc. But the same applies, you are probably folding worse hands and stacking off against better hands.
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martindcx1e
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 3,614
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Miffed22001
You...have to call a push from a better hand which is much worse
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why do you have to call a push? if you call and lead the turn you don't have to call a push and you're putting even more of your stack in.
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Wikipedia is the best thing ever. Anyone in the world can write anything they want about any subject. So you know you are getting the best possible information.
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