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2pair river fold, wasted set value : 5nl 2 hands for review

  
 
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mbiz
Old 07-31-2009, 10:25 AM     Post subject: 2pair river fold, wasted set value : 5nl 2 hands for review #1 (permalink)  
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 hand1:
villain was tight

why did i check the turn? because im dumb..
what im more concerned with is my river raise. my checked turn mightve been my undoing at the river, but was i right to raise here? i felt like i had him dominated but his reraise was huge. (blufflike huge?)

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.05 BB (9 handed) - Poker-Stars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com

UTG+1 ($6.09)
MP1 ($14.08)
Hero (MP2) ($5.34)
MP3 ($5.06)
CO ($10.06)
Button ($2.04)
SB ($9.72)
BB ($1.56)
UTG ($10.36)

Preflop: Hero is MP2 with 9, K
3 folds, Hero calls $0.05, 1 fold, CO calls $0.05, 1 fold, SB calls $0.03, BB checks

Flop: ($0.20) Q, 2, K (4 players)
SB checks, BB checks, Hero bets $0.15, 1 fold, SB calls $0.15, 1 fold

Turn: ($0.50) 7 (2 players)
SB checks, Hero checks

River: ($0.50) 9 (2 players)
SB bets $0.30, Hero raises to $0.90, SB raises to $4.90, Hero folds

Total pot: $2.30 | Rake: $0.10


hand2:
villain was tight

I felt as if a flop raise wouldve pushed him off. but the turn presented many draws so i bet big, too big i guess. Would it have been better to bet smaller into him for bad pot odds on his side and hope for a call?

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.05 BB (9 handed) - Poker-Stars Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com

UTG ($5.25)
UTG+1 ($13.04)
MP1 ($8.61)
Hero (MP2) ($5)
MP3 ($2.55)
CO ($10.04)
Button ($10.15)
SB ($4.22)
BB ($9.09)

Preflop: Hero is MP2 with 9, 9
3 folds, Hero calls $0.05, 3 folds, SB bets $0.30, BB calls $0.25, Hero calls $0.25

Flop: ($0.90) 9, 7, K (3 players)
SB bets $0.35, 1 fold, Hero calls $0.35

Turn: ($1.60) 8 (2 players)
SB bets $0.45, Hero raises to $3.30, 1 fold

Total pot: $2.50 | Rake: $0.10

thanks in advance
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WillburForce
Old 07-31-2009, 12:03 PM #2 (permalink)  
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WillburForce will become famous soon enoughWillburForce will become famous soon enough
 hand 1: why are we limping k-9 in MP? Either raise or fold. now you've flopped a k with a weak kicker and don't have any idea if your hands good.
you've raised flop: Good. You then check the turn? WTF? Bet again.
I'd have called the 1st bet on river - old thing of he only calls with a better hand. did he have 9-9?

Hand 2: u raised a bit too much, but meh, u got a set and want to try and build a big pot, plus there are now flush and straight draws out there. looks ok to me.
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wonderland
Old 07-31-2009, 04:26 PM #3 (permalink)  
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wonderland
aye, enough limping. It's not clever. There are exceptions such as being in late position with a few limpers behind and passive players ahead and you have like Axs or 33 etc.

hand 2. I can see your fear here. Drawy board. Bet less though, no one is calling that and a set is too good to waste.
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Vinland
Old 07-31-2009, 06:09 PM #4 (permalink)  
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 Hand 2) Agree with Wonderland. Charge him to draw, dont blow him out of the water. A pot sized raise is probably plenty.

However, you said he was tight and he raised preflop with 2 to act. He probably wouldnt raise with cards that would give him a straight draw on this board and there arent a lot of holdings that he would raise preflop that give him the flush draw (except maybe AJs+, KQs.), ie not a lot of cards.
The flush was a bit of a stretch for him if he truly is tight and a reraise here should have been to get him to put more money with TPTK imo.
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Old 07-31-2009, 06:57 PM #5 (permalink)  
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hand 1: holy shit batman, stop limping K9s
I wouldn't raise that river in, it feels nitty but tight players don't call with one pair vs. a river raise
he doesn't have K7/K2 in his preflop range, the only hand he can pay you off with here is like Q9s and there are more combos that beat you than combos that pay you off
but hands like 99/77/22/JT are in his range and also KQ, although he didn't have KQ this time (he would just call your raise) when you do get just called on the river he will show up with KQ a lot, and when you get 3b on the river he'll have sets/straight

hand 2: I would say don't raise turn, but his bitch bet is not big enough to be satisfied with just calling
I would just make it right under $2 like you didn't even notice he bet anything
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mbiz
Old 07-31-2009, 11:57 PM #6 (permalink)  
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 hand1:
i know you guys hate open limping but i keep stacking people with monster flops with hands that i dont like to raise (suited connectors, AXs, mid-low pp). I find these low stakes are limp heavy and a monster in a big multiway pot (obv this wasnt a monster) can really pay off?
If i had opened with a raise and the villain called, what extra info do i have about him in this case? Any set, KQ, Kx (doubtful) is in his range still and those are basically the hands im worried about anyway..

And ok re. river raise, i almost always call in that situation but thought i was in some value situation so i tried to be cool - obv i wasnt

hand2:
ok thanks, this is basically what i was thinking in retrospect, but in the heat of the moment i was like uhh i dunno how much would fug his pot odds (obviously a pot sized bet+ would do it) to make an expensive call. so i just shoved.
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Old 08-01-2009, 02:03 AM #7 (permalink)  
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problem #1 with openlimping: bb gets a free look
problem #2 with openlimping: fish don't get punished for playing shit hands as much because they pay very little to hit big

your hand also never flops the nut straight or the nut flush
the only time you flop the nuts is on KK9 or KKK or 999 flops

so if you openlimped A9s I'd like it a lot more
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