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2NL KK versus all-in on turn

  
 
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Qminator
Old 05-18-2009, 03:25 PM     Post subject: 2NL KK versus all-in on turn #1 (permalink)  
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Hello, i've been playing poker for some time now. Browsing through these forums have taught me quite a bit. This is my first post, if i'm doing something wrong please tell me.

Ps: I'm from Belgium so forgive my english.

Against player 43/5/1,3 25 hands

$0.01/$0.02 No Limit Holdem
9 players
Converted at weaktight

Stacks:
UTG rafin19 ($7.89)
UTG+1 nisusboy ($3.59)
MP1 Nunonetes ($2.81)
MP2 Lupus555 ($3.00)
MP3 jaco88xr ($1.92)
CO Bastation ($2.19)
BTN Baz1l1o ($5.54)
SB Hero ($1.83)
BB sub-jct ($2.94)

Pre-flop: ($0.03, 9 players) Hero is SB
rafin19 raises to $0.06, 3 folds, jaco88xr calls $0.06, Bastation calls $0.06, 1 fold, Hero raises to $0.16, 1 fold, rafin19 calls $0.10, jaco88xr folds, Bastation calls $0.10

Flop: ($0.56, 3 players)
Hero bets $0.24, rafin19 folds, Bastation calls $0.24

Turn: ($1.04, 2 players)
Hero bets $0.32, Bastation goes all-in $1.79, Hero ?
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Lucothefish
Old 05-18-2009, 03:30 PM #2 (permalink)  
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 1/ bet more on flop please, $0.50 would be nice. Too many draws plus you have a strong hand.

2/ Bet a LOT more on turn. Get all your money in.

As played, I'd happily call here.

Oh, and welcome to FTR! thanks for not putting in results, did you have any reads on this guy?
<@d0zer> how will you learn if I don't berate you harshly?
 
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ArcadianRock
Old 05-18-2009, 03:50 PM #3 (permalink)  
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Never bet less than 1/2 the pot unless you're trying to control the pot size, but even then what's the point in winning unless it's a lot. At 2nl people don't know how to fold so bet big, all the time. Ending the day with 8 buy-ins is not unheard of.

But yeah, I don't think there are many hands in his range that crush you.
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BooG690
Old 05-18-2009, 04:02 PM #4 (permalink)  
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 As everyone said, bet a lot more on both streets. Bets are measured as compared to the pot. At 2NL where people love calling, bet 2/3 to the full pot.

To be honest, at the 2NL, I'm also 3betting more for value here. They WILL call you.

Try to get all your money in there as fast as possible (without a huge overbet).

That's how winners play; we convince the other guy he's making all the right moves.
 
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AFchung
Old 05-18-2009, 04:53 PM #5 (permalink)  
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bet bigger on flop, bet bigger on turn and you'll be pretty much committed to call a shove
http://afchung.blogspot.com/
 
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tuuk2
Old 05-18-2009, 07:04 PM #6 (permalink)  
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I'd call. I'm putting him either on a flush draw, or straight draw. I'm also putting him on A-Q, K-Qd or Q-Jd. It's quite possible he's got the Queen and the flush draw here so it's not a bad move to semi-bluff you.

Still, I think you call. Having said that, your flop bet was really too small. If your intent was to push him off the hand, you have to at least bet the pot. If your intent was to build the pot, you should have bet 1/2 to 3/4 of it.
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dafu
Old 05-18-2009, 07:12 PM #7 (permalink)  
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I would call he wouldn't call that big of a raise on A5. He could have pocket queens and made a set on the turn or he could have QJ and was hoping to get lucky after the flop. I would call personally.
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2ndline.4thstreet
Old 05-18-2009, 07:47 PM #8 (permalink)  
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I agree with everyone - bet more on all streets. Usually 2/3 of the pot. PF I'm raising to .21 rather than .16.

As played I'm calling. I mean we were trying to induce a shove weren't we? I'd expect to see AQ if he's has any idea what he's doing...
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helpme2win$
Old 05-18-2009, 08:13 PM #9 (permalink)  
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helpme2win$
kings with that board if u dont push hard they are probably gonna hang and catch the straight seein that is the only thing on the turn or river tha would likely take u .
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lockpull
Old 05-18-2009, 08:32 PM #10 (permalink)  
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Am I the only one the think the PF raise should have been bigger (since I don't see it mentioned) . Maybe like .24-.30. The rest of the hand played just like PF as far as the betting being too small. 2.5x is begging the whole table to come along and crack your KK and it is not building a big pot with a big hand. I think the rest of the hand would have played smoother. After that bet bigger in relation to the pot. 2/3rds vs CO on the flop (or I shove if all of them came along with the bigger PF raise.)

As played I call and have your note taking ready.


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Old 05-19-2009, 02:06 AM #11 (permalink)  
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yes, bet pf bigger
btw wtf are you guys talking about, his bet sizing is perfect for three streets of value because the river is a shove
maybe make the turn more like 1/2 pot
but after you 3b you can't fold overpair kings, call because you need to win like 33% of the time (his bet seems around pot)
but you'll win something like 50%
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lockpull
Old 05-19-2009, 07:01 AM #12 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by iopq
yes, bet pf bigger
btw wtf are you guys talking about, his bet sizing is perfect for three streets of value because the river is a shove
maybe make the turn more like 1/2 pot
but after you 3b you can't fold overpair kings, call because you need to win like 33% of the time (his bet seems around pot)
but you'll win something like 50%
Even with the Flush/straight draw out there still bet under 1/2 pot on flop?


Decision making - When decisions are not based on information, it's called gambling
 
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Old 05-19-2009, 07:07 AM #13 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by lockpull
Quote:
Originally Posted by iopq
yes, bet pf bigger
btw wtf are you guys talking about, his bet sizing is perfect for three streets of value because the river is a shove
maybe make the turn more like 1/2 pot
but after you 3b you can't fold overpair kings, call because you need to win like 33% of the time (his bet seems around pot)
but you'll win something like 50%
Even with the Flush/straight draw out there still bet under 1/2 pot on flop?
well the straight draw has no implied odds because we're c/fing a 5 on the turn/river and he probably does not open any hands other than 55 from that position that hit a straight with the ace
flush draw, yes that's the downside of betting so small
but the draws missed and we got the correct result so call now it's perfect... he could be easily shoving his flush draw on the turn because we showed so little strength
seriously folding here is terrible
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daven
Old 05-19-2009, 07:43 AM #14 (permalink)  
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 pre-flop 3-bet bigger. I like 30c here.
Then bet flop close to pot.
Study bet-sizing (e.g. here, but mostly just bet bigger when you are ahead.

Turn situation should never occur, cos if you play earlier streets better life becomes far more simple.

everyone who thinks that villain is semi-bluffing this turn - stop and think harder... his range after his turn raise includes random queens, two pair hands, and sets. Mostly random queens.

iopq - this is too draw-heavy a board and it's a 3-bet pot at $2nl for such crazy small bet-sizing, getting it in on two streets should be easy - how would you feel if villain called turn and river came Ad or 6d etc... probably pretty stupid.
don't raise with the straight flush bro, nobody ever gonna call that shit
allin, reload, repeat

please read: http://www.philgalfond.com/lets-make-some-changes/
 
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Qminator
Old 05-19-2009, 08:45 AM #15 (permalink)  
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Thanks guys, these comments are really helpfull. My bet sizing can really be improved.

I called the all-in and villain showed a QKo. River was a 7s. I won the hand.
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Old 05-19-2009, 09:07 AM #16 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by Qminator
Thanks guys, these comments are really helpfull. My bet sizing can really be improved.

I called the all-in and villain showed a QKo. River was a 7s. I won the hand.
but your post says you folded
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Stacks
Old 05-19-2009, 09:15 AM #17 (permalink)  
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 3bet larger preflop. Villain made it 3xbb, and with 2 callers you made it 8xbb. Without any callers you should be making it like 9xbb; however, with 2 callers I would bet a good deal larger to like 15xbb or maybe even bigger at 2nl, as they are more likely to call with a wider range.

After that, bet flop larger, and get it in on the turn.
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Lucothefish
Old 05-19-2009, 09:27 AM #18 (permalink)  
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 where does it say that iopq?
<@d0zer> how will you learn if I don't berate you harshly?
 
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AFchung
Old 05-19-2009, 11:55 AM #19 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lucothefish
where does it say that iopq?
at the end you can see the italicized gray "Hero?"

OP didn't change the font of the converter which says Hero folded
http://afchung.blogspot.com/
 
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Qminator
Old 05-19-2009, 12:41 PM #20 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AFchung
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lucothefish
where does it say that iopq?
at the end you can see the italicized gray "Hero?"

OP didn't change the font of the converter which says Hero folded
I did this fond cause is saw it in other HH, wanted to do the same. I'll post the entire HH when i find it.

Started raising more and it's starting to pay off. Normally i would make tiny little profits. Mentally, i know it sounds stupid, i still have to make 'the step'. Betting + 50 cent on a pair against a calling player still gets my hart racing. (Eventough you can't buy a soda for it.)
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Old 05-19-2009, 03:45 PM #21 (permalink)  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Qminator
Quote:
Originally Posted by AFchung
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lucothefish
where does it say that iopq?
at the end you can see the italicized gray "Hero?"

OP didn't change the font of the converter which says Hero folded
I did this fond cause is saw it in other HH, wanted to do the same. I'll post the entire HH when i find it.
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