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10NL open AQo UTG, btn calls and minraises my cbet

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mbiz

04-11-2010, 07:35 AM Post subject: 10NL open AQo UTG, btn calls and minraises my cbet

#1 (permalink)

Straight

Join Date: Jun 2009

Location: Orstraya

Posts: 178

mbiz is an unknown quantity at this point

Villain is 14/10/3 over ~300 hands.

Have been involved in a hand previously where i cbet some flop with Ahigh then hit an A on turn and he folded to my barrel.

I felt a bit lost on the turn - bet? c/c ?
When he minraise me I think he has lots of PP's that i beat, JT, KJ, AK, AQ, AJ, QJ, JJ, QQ. Maybe T9.
Those flop minraises just reek of bs to me.

$0.05/$0.10 No Limit Holdem
8 Players
Hand Conversion Powered by weaktight.com

Stacks:
UTG Hero ($10.65)
UTG+1 highdareguys ($10.15)
MP1 bucs2002 ($10)
MP2 Lars Botman ($17.50)
CO 69XxchadxX69 ($13.25)
BTN Ghostkiki ($9.80)
SB DustyDog771 ($16.75)
BB c7rfnmn ($10)

Pre-Flop: ($0.15, 8 players) Hero is UTG

Hero raises to $0.40, 4 folds, Ghostkiki calls $0.40, 2 folds

Flop:

($0.95, 2 players)
Hero bets $0.70, Ghostkiki raises to $1.40, Hero calls $0.70

Turn:

($3.75, 2 players)
[color=#cc0000][b]Hero ???

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rpm

04-11-2010, 07:47 AM

#2 (permalink)

4-of-a-Kind

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Location: learnin'

Posts: 2,039

Quote:

Originally Posted by mbiz

Villain is 14/10/3 over ~300 hands.

I felt a bit lost on the turn - bet? c/c ?
When he minraise me I think he has lots of PP's that i beat, JT, KJ, AK, AQ, AJ, QJ, JJ, QQ. Maybe T9.
Those flop minraises just reek of bs to me.

if it reeks of bs, why does so much of the range you put him on above ^^ have you beat? i really hate dealing with minraisers unless i have managed to get a note on what kind of range they are doing it with. i honestly have no idea what his range could be here because its so villain-specific. given he's pretty tight though i'm thinking its more of a badly sized value-raise than a fishy raise-it-up-cos-me-flopped-a-pair raise. those (second) types of minraises are usually for the 54/10 guys.

mbiz

04-11-2010, 12:09 PM

#3 (permalink)

Straight

Join Date: Jun 2009

Location: Orstraya

Posts: 178

good point. the range i put him on was after the fact but at the time i just didnt believe him. this is why i posted the hand, because im not sure at how to deal with flop minraises.

I guess i felt it was bs because whenever im min raised but have a monster, they very rarely showdown. So while i put those cards in his range i figured it was weighted towards PPs and the SC's. But you're right i dont have minraise reads on him.

rpm

04-11-2010, 01:21 PM

#4 (permalink)

4-of-a-Kind

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i'd take my analysis pretty lightly mind you. as i said, i struggle with ranges for unknown minraisers as well. but based on what little information we have on our opponent in this spot (taggy preflop stats), i'm guessing he doesn't have 44-88 or absolute air here very much.

kmind

04-11-2010, 03:12 PM

#5 (permalink)

Straight Flush

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Posts: 4,240

Fold flop. I think he doesn't have a PP lower than a set and he doesn't have a pair worse than yours.

Edit: Ok call flop didn't notice it was minraise. But c/f now.

rong

04-11-2010, 03:14 PM

#6 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Nov 2008

Location: Beachside

Posts: 1,196

I have a sneaking suspicion that you are behind here. I just don't see what he could have that you beat. I'd prob cc turn and try to get to a cheap showdown. But I'd be careful, as if his turn bet sizing looks like he's setting up for a river shove, which I wouldn't be calling, it may be better to get out sooner rather than later.

The only reason I'd say c/c rather than fold the flop is that there may well be some complete air in his range, and you may find he closes up now that his raise has been called.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Micro2Macro

hey guys, if you ever make a snap call on the river when your opponent raises you're fucking retarded.

Fucking. Retarded.

rong

04-11-2010, 03:17 PM

#7 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Nov 2008

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Just noticed the club on the turn. You now have 12 outs to the nuts, so I'd def c/c.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Micro2Macro

hey guys, if you ever make a snap call on the river when your opponent raises you're fucking retarded.

Fucking. Retarded.

sk8r_daniel

04-11-2010, 03:22 PM

#8 (permalink)

Flush

Join Date: Jun 2006

Posts: 330

Quote:

Originally Posted by DanAronG

Just noticed the club on the turn. You now have 12 outs to the nuts, so I'd def c/c.

Yeah... still only 3 clubs out there.

So on a Q we check call the turn, fold to river barrel?

Donachello

04-11-2010, 04:24 PM

#9 (permalink)

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Quote:

Originally Posted by DanAronG

Just noticed the club on the turn. You now have 12 outs to the nuts, so I'd def c/c.

wat?

We'd need a little bit more info to make an actually informed decision here. Has she shown down any out of line hands? Doesn he minraise a lot of flops? Does he minraise the nuts? All that shit is pretty vital if you want to make a good decision here. If you think he is bluffing which is pretty unlikely for a 13/10 what is our plan for the rest of the hand? Are we willing to get it in or are we just hoping to folds to a second barrel?

I feel like a lot of the time he's got KJ or AJ here but I don't know the table dynamic. fwiw I think being a 13/10/3 he's very rarely got a large PP but this looks an awful lot like 2pair or KQ, JQ semi-bluffing. Check the turn.

[00:29] <daven> dc, why not check turn behind
[00:30] <DC> daven
[00:30] <DC> on my hand?
[00:30] <daven> yep
[00:30] <DC> because I am drunk
[00:30] <daven> nice reason
[00:30] <daven> no further questions
[00:30] <yaawn> ^^Lol

Problem officer...?

Hoopy

04-11-2010, 04:25 PM

#10 (permalink)

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Hoopy is an unknown quantity at this point

Don't think you can include JJ,QQ or AK in his range since he'll 3 bet pre most of the time, also think a PP would be unlikely to do this with his stats.

His range might look something like {QT,KJ,AQ,AJ,AT,A9,A8,JT,T9,KT}, I'd probably call the min raise and c/f all non A turns because I think he might pot control with some weaker Ax hands by checking back (depends on how he views you), Queen would be a bad card as it would stop us getting value from hands like AJ and give Tx the nuts.

I don't think we should try to play a big pot here.

rong

04-11-2010, 04:46 PM

#11 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Nov 2008

Location: Beachside

Posts: 1,196

doh! Thought you had AQs. Hung over, please ignore.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Micro2Macro

hey guys, if you ever make a snap call on the river when your opponent raises you're fucking retarded.

Fucking. Retarded.

sk8r_daniel

04-11-2010, 07:16 PM

#12 (permalink)

Flush

Join Date: Jun 2006

Posts: 330

On. a Q turn I think I call a 1/2 pot bet or less on the turn and c/f river unimproved to any normal bet.

surviva316

04-12-2010, 01:32 AM

#13 (permalink)

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to those advocating folding the flop, you realize that this means we will fold all but 18 combos? also, he's repping like JJ and sometimes AK/AJ (wtf at some of the ranges that are being thrown out there, he doesn't have A9 and i wouldn't expect him to 3b JJ pre). and why would he min raise a set or a two pair on this board?

i call flop and c/f the turn. i'd obv fold flop if his raise were bigger

Quote:

Originally Posted by BooG690

I just wanted to share singing vaginas.

Imthenewfish

04-28-2010, 02:32 AM

#14 (permalink)

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When I usually get into these situations they're flop raise represents a hand with some showdown strength and they're drawing. Q10, K10, AQ, A10, 1010 are hands I usually see when I get in these situations. AJ is possible sometimes.. Q or 10 on the turn could tell you where you're at. I'd probably c/f the turn

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10NL open AQo UTG, btn calls and minraises my cbet

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