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dev
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04-19-2006, 08:07 PM
Post subject: *NOT* protecting against draws
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#1 (permalink)
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: swonging and swonging
Posts: 1,550
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I considered not posting this because it can give some bad ideas to some newer players, but then I figure there IS a beginner section, and this ain't it. I'm exploring my less agro side.
Sometimes it's ok not to protect against draws.
Like when you're at a table full of taggs who will fold their draws on a Td9c2d board to a 3/4pot bet.
This is opposed to tables where the guy with QJo calls you down to the river because of the what-ifs.
Or when you're first to act on the flop with AKo and the board is As9s4d and it's you and only one or two other players. If the guy with AQ decides he's good when the turn blanks, you can make a lot more money I think.
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dpe8598
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Flush
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 261
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You are absolutely right dev. What many forget is that you are ahead whether you bet big or not. Just because you are giving someone odds to call, doesn't mean you are losing money. On the other hand, if they would have called more, than you are losing money by not betting more, because you you could have gotten them to call more, but that isn't always the case.
In general, I love to fire out, but there are certainly times to change it up, even against nasty textures.
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Pelion
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 3,206
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I do this sometimes but only in small pots. Dont do it in a big pot though. You give up too much when they catch. You have to be able to lay it down when a scare card comes and they get agro.
Also the sorts of hand where I have AK and he has AQ are raised pots so they are by definition, getting towards the large side.
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gabe: Ive dropped almost 100k in the past 35 days.
bigspenda73: But how much did you win?
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dev
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: swonging and swonging
Posts: 1,550
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If you're deep-stacked, in a NL game, the pot size is relative. I play a lot of deep-stacked games.
How about when the draws come out and you get to bluff it off of trips or T9s for two pair?
That last bit is really read-dependant, but I'm looking for good reasons to not be so agro.
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Check out my self-deprecation here!
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piratepeaty
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Straight
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 121
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by dev
If you're deep-stacked, in a NL game, the pot size is relative. I play a lot of deep-stacked games.
How about when the draws come out and you get to bluff it off of trips or T9s for two pair?
That last bit is really read-dependant, but I'm looking for good reasons to not be so agro.
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Why are you looking for reasons not to be aggressive?
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dev
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: swonging and swonging
Posts: 1,550
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I am really agro...
If you have a copy of ToP, turn to page 272, I'm #11.
There have been a few discussions here where I posted bet, bet, bet. Then posters with good results and smart posts say, no, I think the soft way is better here. I figure the best way to open my game to the softer side is to actively seek it.
I want to play some estrogen-enhanced poker! 
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jackvance
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 2,910
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by dev
That last bit is really read-dependant, but I'm looking for good reasons to not be so agro.
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- People like to bluff. It's cool. So let em.
- People only put money on the table when they think they have the best hand. So let em think that.
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piratepeaty
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Straight
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 121
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by dev
I am really agro...
If you have a copy of ToP, turn to page 272, I'm #11.
There have been a few discussions here where I posted bet, bet, bet. Then posters with good results and smart posts say, no, I think the soft way is better here. I figure the best way to open my game to the softer side is to actively seek it.
I want to play some estrogen-enhanced poker! |
I was hoping it was something like that. This is really something that experience teaches. While you get that experience always think about why you are doing something. Ask yourself questions as you play and after your finished playing. Why did you bet? was it for value? protection? what will you do if you get raised? if he calls? what do you do if a diamond comes? a brick? How big is the pot? How strong is my hand.
Poker is a thinking game. The best way to beat it is by thinking. I like that you are are asking these question and you notice a leak in your game. However, you are missing alot of variables in your examples, so I cannot comment.
The best way to learn this is to learn the fundamental strategy and theory, apply it (usually incorrectly), relearn the fundamentals, re-apply it.
Getting feedback is great, and yes you are correct that there are times to slow down. However, you didn't give enough information to give a concrete answer.
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dev
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4-of-a-Kind
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: swonging and swonging
Posts: 1,550
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by piratepeaty
Getting feedback is great, and yes you are correct that there are times to slow down. However, you didn't give enough information to give a concrete answer.
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I'm asking for examples of when it's a good idea to slow down in order to extract value. I am very good at getting out when my hand can't be good anymore.
What I'm hoping for is to add something to my thought process that helps me get the most from a hand even against scared players or rocktastics.
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bigboy5540
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Flush
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: california
Posts: 253
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the most important thing, dev is if you slowplay you must be able to get away from the hand if they end up catching up to you. If not, and many people can not, then you are losing both value, and leaking a lot of chips away when you do this.
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im good at poker
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