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Ragnar4

08-06-2006, 08:26 AM Post subject: You Just Earned Yo-Self a Check-RAISE!

#1 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Sep 2005

Location: Billings, Montana

Posts: 1,284

Today I was asked by one of my co-workers/quasi-students about check-raising. The exact phrasing of the question was: "Just h0w often do you checkraise, Doug?"

Like any poker answer, I could only lead with the words, "Well it depends."

Simple fact of the matter is; if you think that checkraising is simply a tool used to bluff someone, or that you measure success, or failure by how often your checkraising, you've got the concept all wrong. Maybe everyone here at the lower limits knows this, I'm hoping we all do, but maybe, and hopefully, there's someone out there that will say... ooooh I get it, and their game will be enriched.

The most important part of the checkraise, is that before you've even decided to checkraise, you've asked yourself one poingant question, and then another:
First Question: "Where am I in the hand, ahead, drawing, made but behind, or completely off?"
Second Question: "How do I want to affect the rest of this hand?" This question is the clincher!

A checkraise can be a tool used to trap opponents for extra bets, a way to thin the field, or a way to give your drawing hands a monster sized pot. All 3 of those things are achieved by utilizing the checkraise. You can't use a move unless you know WHY you're using the move.

Each and every poker book out there will suggest to you that if you think you're ahead, and you're ahead in a hand, you should simply lead out. The introduction to the concept of the checkraise is always followed with the argument that using the checkraise to put more bets in the pot either earns you 2 bets or none, and that people wise up to the checkraise trap quite quickly. I agree with this argument. Playing straightforward most of the time will win you the most money over time, and will make those times when you should be checkraising more profitable. The checkraise is a tool that all profesional players use, but they do not use it as often as TV leads us to believe.

Playing straightforward and aggressively allows the checkraise to become a tool, but the most important part of the checkraise is not what you are doing, but what your opponents are doing. A checkraise cannot be achieved unless an opponent is willing to bet out. Common knowledge, right? It's up to you to look at those other players you're playing against in their beedy little eyes, and you need to pry into their soul, and eventually gleam information as to who is going to bet, and who is going to check.

If you have a hand that is vulnerable, say: top pair top kicker against a highly co-ordinated board with scary striaght cards, say 9,T,2. People limp Q,J.. People limp KJ, and KQ, heck even 87 is dangerous here. Anyone with 2 suited cards could be on the 23-1 redraw special. Answer to first question: In the drivers seat Top pair top kicker here is usually pretty good. Answer to the 2nd question: I need to thin the field, because there are a lot of nasty draws out there that take me out of the drivers seat. You need to look around and see if the closest guy in the hand to your right is going to lead. You hope he is, you hope you check, every other clown checks, and he raises cuz he's on the button and he's not gonna let anyone see a free card, then you checkraise! Now, those clowns who were getting 6-1 on their draws are getting 4-1. Even though they still may call, Poker is about making people make poor decisions, and calling an up and down straight draw here now is the wrong choice. The good players fold, the bad players call, and you win money in the long run. You let the guy to your immediate right help you turn a good draw into a bad draw... You thinned the field.

This time lets say you're sitting on the big blind with "Rocket killers" JT suited (of course) in clubs. Flop turns Ac Qd 9c Even though 2nd position raised, you had enough callers to justify JT to catch a co-0rdinated flop, say 2 plus. Answer to the first question: Drawing, I have 6 outs to the nuts, and 9 more outs to a darn strong hand. Here's the interesting part, you think the Preflop raiser just made AAA, he's bucking around in his seat, and he wants to put his chips in the pot before the flop is out, IF you get even 1 caller, you get equity to re-raise here, to get a lot of money in the pot. (just because you represent in this situation 25% of the players, does not mean you're going to win 25% of the time. In fact here' youre going to win 45ish percent of the time) So you check, AAA makes it one bet, and both guys call, so you raise AAA looks at you and re-raises. One limper mutters and folds, the other sighs and calls, you re-raise, and it's a call call. This time, you used your position, and knowledge of who was in the game, and who was going to bet out to help make yourself money in the long run. A check raise can help pad the pot, and increase your expected value in the long run, as long as the player nearest your left bets out, and you get a few callers. To be concise, you must have more callers, than your odds of winning the hand. So if you're 33% to win the hand (up and down striaght draw) and there are 4 players in the hand, (25% of the pot is represented by you) you should be going for the checkraise to build a nasty huge pot that you take down. Another Checkraise for another situation.

There are many more things that checkraises can do along the nuances of the game, but each one sits somewhere in these 3 examples. Either to trap someone for more bets, to thin the field for some reason, or to build a pot; The reason why you're doing these three things is up to you, and how creative you are, how good your reads are, and simply how you want to be percieved at the table.

Good luck, and good gambling friends.[/b]

The older I get, the more I start wondering; Just what in the hell is going on here?

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lonnie

08-07-2006, 02:39 AM

#2 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Aug 2004

Posts: 923

My most common use of the check raise:

If I'm in the SB or BB, I will check raise flops against a LP preflop raiser when I have TPGK kinds of hands. Isolation move to make draws pay and to push out slightly better or slightly inferior hands.

Shark Bait

08-07-2006, 03:48 AM

#3 (permalink)

Flush

Join Date: Mar 2005

Posts: 481

What about the check raise bluff? I've probably done it once in low stakes limit. But now as I am seeing more and more players folding to a check raise, even on the flop, I'm beginning to think it may be an option.

Check raise works great when you have a made hand at low stakes because people will often call you down. But like I said, I'm seeing more people folding to the check raise, and just betting out when you have a made hand on the flop is starting to be the clear winner. People may think they have you beat on the turn if you bet the flop and the turn, but they're not so sure if you check raise the turn. Better to think they have you beat when they don't.

Yes, it sucks when it gets checked through on the flop and checked to you again on the turn when you flop quads, but now you bet on the turn and everyone is now looking at calling a big bet with a small pot, even less chance you're going to make money.

Here's my example. This would have been a "standard" check raise situation for many people and sometimes myself. Betting makes more money in this hand. UTG+2 thinks I probably have top pair because who bets sets, right? This terrible player probably would have just called down a check raise, but here he has no trouble re-raising me.

PokerStars 3/6 Hold'em (10 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: FlopTurnRiver)

Preflop: Hero is UTG+1 with 9

, 9

. CO posts a blind of $3.
1 fold, Hero calls, UTG+2 raises, 7 folds, Hero calls.

Flop: (6.33 SB) 9

, 4

, J

(2 players)
Hero bets, UTG+2 calls.

Turn: (4.16 BB) T

(2 players)
Hero bets, UTG+2 raises, Hero 3-bets, UTG+2 caps, Hero calls.

River: (12.16 BB) 7

(2 players)
Hero bets, UTG+2 raises, Hero calls.

Final Pot: 16.16 BB

Results in white below:
Hero has 9d 9h (three of a kind, nines).
UTG+2 has Jh Ad (one pair, jacks).
Outcome: Hero wins 16.16 BB.

<a500lbgorilla> Limit is poker with training wheels!

Nehmer

08-07-2006, 04:33 AM

#4 (permalink)

Full House

Join Date: Oct 2004

Location: Decatur, IL

Posts: 666

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shark Bait

The only time I have ever really found the check raise bluff to be worthwhile is in situation where I am semi-bluffing a flush draw or open-ended straight draw typed hand on the turn vs a TAggy typed opponent or certain LAggy guys that bet the flop/turn and probably raised preflop.

midas06

08-07-2006, 05:46 AM

#5 (permalink)

4-of-a-Kind

Join Date: Jun 2005

Location: NZ

Posts: 2,196

Or in some blind defense situations when tricky villains will run lines on you

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