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LockLow34
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10-22-2004, 04:54 AM
Post subject: "So do you have the straight?"
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#1 (permalink)
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Flush
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Ashburn, VA
Posts: 266
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Live game, 3/6 Hold'em, table switches from loose-passive to loose-aggressive.
In the small blind with
 
No raise, 5 callers so I complete. Flop comes
  
I check(for deception later on), big blind checks, UTG bets, MP calls, I call, big blind calls.
turn card
I check, bb checks, UTG bets, previous caller raises (hmm..he's also got 76 or QQ, I think), I raise, bb folds, UTG calls, MP raises (now I'm about 60% sure he's got QQ..just a feeling), I call, UTG calls.
River
(ouch, trouble..but I'm resigning to losing 2 bets here because the pot is so big) I bet, UTG folds, MP raises (sh*t), I call
and he asks..."So do you have the straight?" and turns over
 
(I love my regular game)
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Fnord
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Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: I'll Do You Like A Truck
Posts: 19,333
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I don't get how not raising that flop is deceptive. I'm looking to bet or check/raise that flop and pray I can cap it 3+ way. The low limit fish don't understand the value of betting "on the come".
Every other street very well played.
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elipsesjeff
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Moderator
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Northern Virginia
Posts: 4,900
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Quote:
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now I'm about 60% sure he's got QQ
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I have trouble putting him on this hand. Wouldn't you expect a raise preflop in a live game with QQ? Just a thought.
Plus, Fnord, you cap the flop on all open ended straight/4 to flush draws? or just both open ended + 4 to flush draw? It is true that you want to put a lot of money into the pot but if you convey strength are you risking losing other possible callers? Again, another thought.
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Fnord
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Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: I'll Do You Like A Truck
Posts: 19,333
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by elipsesjeff
Plus, Fnord, you cap the flop on all open ended straight/4 to flush draws? or just both open ended + 4 to flush draw? It is true that you want to put a lot of money into the pot but if you convey strength are you risking losing other possible callers? Again, another thought.
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I would be looking to trap as many players for as many bets as possible on the flop. The Hero's hand is over 50% to complete one of his draws, a monster 6 way! Building a pot will make them more likely to call down with hands that are of no threat to your completed draw. The only problem is that as the aggressor you lose some of your implied odds. However, sometimes this is offset by winning the pot outright via aggression. Hence, I might slow down to a 3-bet planning to check/raise when I hit.
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LockLow34
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Flush
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Ashburn, VA
Posts: 266
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Fnord
I don't get how not raising that flop is deceptive. I'm looking to bet or check/raise that flop and pray I can cap it 3+ way. The low limit fish don't understand the value of betting "on the come".
Every other street very well played.
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The problems I had here were position and players in the hand. Being first to act, had I check-raised the flop the players that were in the hand would have NOT bet on the turn, or wouldn't have called 2 bets cold. (Except for the idiot with aces.) Also the players in the hand, BB and UTG have a clue about how to play. By showing weakness early I was able to get 2 players for 4 big bets each instead of 3 players for 3 small bets each.
Basically I didn't think I'd be able to get away with 2 check-raises. Had I been in a different position I would have played it differently.
Quote:
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I have trouble putting him on this hand. Wouldn't you expect a raise preflop in a live game with QQ? Just a thought.
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Well, he DID turn over a big pair like I thought. And with how aggressively he played the turn I thought he put me on 2 pair. I guess just by my read on him in the hand (remember this is a live game) I felt like he had a big pair and not a straight.
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LockLow34
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Flush
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Ashburn, VA
Posts: 266
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The more I think about it the more I think I should have bet out on the flop then just called any raises and check-raised the turn.
I posted this over at 2+2 for further comment on the betting on the flop
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